Citizenship and Immigration Committee on Nov. 20th, 2025

[Costas Menegakis, Conservative, Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you to our witnesses for appearing before us.

I'm trying to get a handle on why you need the massive power of mass cancellations. You seem to have some concern, or maybe disrespect, I might add, although that's a hard word to accept, I know, about doing this through legislation. You commented that legislation takes a long time. There's a reason that legislation takes a long time; it requires parliamentary oversight, debate, review and a lot of detail before we get to a point where we have a piece of legislation in front of us to discuss.

Here we are today with a piece of legislation that, quite frankly, we were not expecting. We do have it before us. You don't want to go through the legislative process. You want this massive power that can override what parliamentarians as legislators are really elected to do, which is represent the people.

Please explain why you cannot respect what's been done already so far, the legislative process, and now you want this massive power where you can say, “This is good enough reason for me, country Mike or country Susan, whatever. I want to be able to have the power to do it without asking any elected official of the people to have an opinion.”

[Tara Lang]

I think we have seen that, in recent times, the world has changed, and we have seen such different emerging threats, whether they're health, safety, security or fraud.

The minister of IRCC does not have this power unilaterally. The decision rests with the Governor in Council, who acts on behalf of cabinet. On the advice of cabinet, the Governor in Council would consider—

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

You have one minute.

[Tara Lang]

—all of the views of the Government of Canada collectively. It ensures broad scrutiny and alignment with overall government priorities, and it has a system of checks and balances.

[Costas Menegakis, Conservative, Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, ON]

You only have one minute, as you heard from the chair, so let me just get in on this a little.

These are new regulatory executive powers. The minister does have that authority because it's the minister who is going to prepare that memorandum to cabinet and is going to go in there, asking for the sweeping power without coming back to Parliament, at a time when—as Mr. McCrorie has testified before this committee—there are already 30,000 people in the country whom they can't find and at a time when we're talking about a one-touch system. He has a different opinion than the elected person of the union of the employees under Mr. McCrorie's direction. They came here with a voice as well. Their morale is down. They're not happy. They're not satisfied.

Mr. McCrorie, you may want to paint a different picture today because you may be at odds with what Mr. Weber says, but the fact of the matter is that you represent the same people.

For us to overlook all of that and say to give the sweeping powers to the minister—the seventh minister in 10 years—so you can say, “You know, we want this, Minister. Go ahead and get it for us in an order in council and ignore Parliament and the will of the Canadian people”.... You understand how difficult that is for us as legislators to accept, do you not?

[Tara Lang]

I really do think that the use of these powers could be handled in the public interest. The order in council process, with a whole-of-government approach, taking in considerations from all equal members, is part of our government process. I think the checks and balances and the transparency are present in order to help this—

[Costas Menegakis, Conservative, Aurora—Oak Ridges—Richmond Hill, ON]

I would argue that it would be in the public interest to not have people with criminal records walking around the streets while waiting to complete their 45-day term so that they can finish their screen—

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Thank you, Mr. Menegakis.

Thank you Ms. Lang.

We now go to four minutes with Mr. Fragiskatos.

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London Centre, ON]

Thank you Madam Chair. I'll be splitting time with Ms. Sodhi to make up her time that she gave to me.

Ms. Lang, can you continue to give examples or expand on the ones that you've given?

I go back to this point because I think it is absolutely central to this bill. Cancellation of documents is something that, understandably, has raised questions among advocates, including, as you see, members on this committee. I think the examples can do the talking. Please continue and let us know as a committee, through those examples, how this would ultimately improve Canadian security.

[Tara Lang]

Thank you for that.

When threat actors are engaged in certain activities, they generally seek to disguise their intent and enter Canada singly to better avoid detection. It is plausible that scenarios may arise that involve large cohorts—for instance, a foreign national naval or research vessel seeking access to Canadian waters and ports, an academic or trade business delegation or a large cohort of temporary visa holders entering Canada for a specific project or work in a specific sector.

It's also plausible that foreign nationals could seek to enter Canada to participate in activities or events that constitute or contribute to threats to the national security or public safety. In these cases, the event or destination might be the key to identifying the cohort. The Governor in Council could issue an order in council to, for example, mass-suspend documents while investigations are completed. This would eliminate the risk that such nefarious actors could travel to Canada. This is one of the reasons it needs to be nimble and needs to be exercised in this manner. It's because it is on the spot and as it is happening.

Another way that these authorities could be used is to address, for instance, an immigration situation caused by a domestic natural disaster, such as an earthquake or wildfire. The authorities could, for example, mass-extend work or study permits or amend permits to allow for working or studying in another region if this became necessary. It could also be used to quickly facilitate extensions of stay for temporary residents in Canada following a natural disaster or armed conflict in a other country that make leaving to return to the home country difficult or impossible, or following, as mentioned, the COVID-19 pandemic or other health crises.

IRCC had to reissue several permits and documents to persons who had to stay in Canada longer than they had initially planned and who needed to work to support themselves and their families. These authorities could have been used to extend the validity of those work permits en masse, which would have avoided the significant backlogs that were accumulated in all lines of business postpandemic, and they would allow us to continue to impact the economy in a positive manner.

[Amandeep Sodhi, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

My question is for the IRCC officials. We've heard that the new one-year ineligibility for asylum claimants introduced by Bill C-12 could disproportionately impact women, marginalized communities and other survivors of gender-based violence.

Can you tell us if IRCC has looked at how different groups like these may be impacted by these provisions? Are you confident that minority groups will be protected under this legislation?

[Jason Hollmann]

Thanks for the question.

I indicated earlier that we did a gender-based analysis. Broadly, many of those groups would benefit from a fast asylum system. Regarding those directed towards the pre-removal risk assessment, we train people to take into account various vulnerabilities when dealing with sensitive situations as they go forward and interact with clients, so that the pre-removal risk assessment can take into account the specific circumstances a client might experience.

[Amandeep Sodhi, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Thank you.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Thank you, Ms. Sodhi.

Thank you, Mr. Hollmann.

Mr. Brunelle‑Duceppe, you have the floor for a minute and a half.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you very much.

Are the officials who process asylum claims the same as those who conduct pre-removal risk assessments?

[Jason Hollmann]

Thank you for your question.

Generally, we have specific officers who work on the pre-removal risk assessments. They receive at least six months of training and mentoring, and—

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

So the officials who process asylum claims receive different training from the officials who conduct pre-removal risk assessments.

[Jason Hollmann]

In terms of IRCC's role on asylum claimants, we review eligibility—

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

I'm sorry, but I don't have a lot of time. They're trained differently. Is that correct?

[Jason Hollmann]

Decisions on regular asylum claims are made by another organization, the Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Okay, so these are different types of training.

As you said earlier, many more cases will be transferred for a pre-removal risk assessment. The volume of applications will therefore skyrocket in that area, but overall, the volume of applications won't change. It will simply be transferred from one organization to another. Also, because the training is different, there won't be enough officers trained to do the pre-removal risk assessments.

Do you realize that if Bill C‑12 is passed as it is, not only will the overall volume of applications not change, but processing times will also greatly increase because of the lack of training?

[Jason Hollmann]

We have existing trained officers who are already implementing the pre-removal risk assessment program. They would be those who are working on—

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

You told us that the volume was going to skyrocket.

[The Chair, Liberal, Julie Dzerowicz]

Monsieur Brunelle-Duceppe, please let him answer the question. Then it's time.

Answer in 15 seconds, please, Mr. Hollmann.

[Jason Hollmann]

Sure. Thank you, Madam Chair.

We are also increasing our operational capacity. We've already been working on increasing that capacity with additional training and additional staff capacity to make sure we're ready for the higher volumes.