Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Nov. 17th, 2009

[Jennifer Byram]

I have never thought of going to Nunavut, so I don't know what's there, if there are any restrictions or not.

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

Okay.

Back to the highway again, are there other businesses or companies that have significant issues with the highway? Are you talking as a single company with a big problem having to cut your triple-seven trailers? Or are there other businesses that have major issues with the highway?

[Jennifer Byram]

I think there would be other businesses. I would think anyone who has a wide load would have issues coming up the highway. I would think anyone who has a heavy load would have issues coming up the highway. I would think that if the pipeline ever went through, they would have issues, because how are they going to get that many rigs up the highway and get through the Muncho Lake area?

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Thank you, Mr. Duncan.

Mr. Gaudet, you have the floor.

[Roger Gaudet, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My first question is for Ms. Massie. In your opening remarks, you asked when the Government of Canada was going to consult the Yukon first nations and take their needs into account in terms of the Alaska gas pipeline. Is the Canadian government talking to the territorial government, or has it left you completely out of the process?

[Chief Ruth Massie]

Yes, the Government of Canada has flowed transfer funds to the Yukon government and the Yukon government does have an oil and gas division. I do believe their budget is around $5 million to $7 million annually.

[Roger Gaudet, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

I agree with you, but are you part of the negotiation process? I do not think you are in on the negotiations to get a share of that $5 million to $7 million.

[Chief Ruth Massie]

No, we are not actually the Yukon government. We as an organization have approached the Yukon government for support, and they have provided our operations $200,000 a year, just for support staff. That's the extent we have. CEAA, which is the agency for the environment, has provided funds, proposal-driven funds, I might add, for educational workshops, and so on. Right now we have a proposal for $140,000 for a workshop that's going to happen in February, plus guidelines projects for our community, which is additional information.

[Roger Gaudet, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

What are you expecting from the Canadian government?

[Chief Ruth Massie]

What we had approached Canada for was a business plan over a five-year period to create one position in each community to get started. We have asked the Government of Yukon to support us annually, and they have agreed. We have also approached industry, and because we're dealing with two proponents, that ask is outstanding with industry.

[Roger Gaudet, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

Thank you.

Mr. Clarkson, is the government talking to the territories about the navigable waters issue, or are you excluded from the negotiations?

[Randy Clarkson]

I'm not part of these negotiations, but I do understand that a contingent from NavCanada did come and meet with the Yukon government and there was some kind of an arrangement to speed up placer applications. However, it did not go as far as to offload the responsibility or delegate the Yukon inspectors to carry out the inspections.

[Roger Gaudet, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

How many inspectors would you need to settle the issue of navigable and unnavigable waters?

[Randy Clarkson]

I don't think you need a single additional inspector, because those same placer inspectors, the Yukon placer inspectors, go out to every site at least once a year. So it's not a matter of more personnel, it's just a matter of those same placer inspectors, the same fellows, wearing one more hat. Right now, when they're inspecting a placer mine, they represent the Department of Fisheries and Oceans, they represent Environment Canada, and they represent the Government of the Yukon. So they would just wear another hat and represent Transport Canada as well.

[Roger Gaudet, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

Ms. Byram, this morning, your representative said that 10,000 miles of road have been completed.

How much are you missing in order to be able to deliver food to every community through the food mail program? How many miles of road or highway would you need so that every community in the territory could receive food at a price that was affordable, not super high?

[Jennifer Byram]

I think you're talking about Old Crow and Stephen Mills. The road into the community is about 200 kilometres that we build into the winter road, which we've done three times that I know of since 1980. That is just a winter road. We start building it in mid-January and it's out by April.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Thank you very much, Mr. Gaudet.

We will now continue with Mr. Payne, who has the floor for five minutes.

Following Mr. Payne will be Mr. Bevington.

Mr. Payne.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I will probably have some questions for each of the witnesses today.

As a comment to you, Jennifer Byram, to build a road in the Antarctic must have been quite a feat. I'm assuming that you can take the technology you've used and do that anywhere in our north.

[Jennifer Byram]

That's true. We've built many things in northern Canada.

The only tricky part was to get to Antarctica, because of course we had to use the South Klondike Highway to Skagway and barge everything down to Chile, and then over into Antarctica. When we actually got to the job, it was quite simple. It was just getting all the parts and pieces over there for the two-year job.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

Thank you.

Mr. Clarkson, you talked about the various streams, and so on. I find that quite interesting, because I did a little bit of reading on it. Are you familiar with the streams that are maybe in question for the mining?

[Randy Clarkson]

Yes, I'm actually very familiar with them. I work with the Klondike Placer Miners' Association. I also help some of the miners try to get their licensing.

If you don't live here, you have no way to know if a stream is large or small, or intermittent, or has rapids on it or waterfalls, or anything of that nature. But if you live here and you work in the area, you have a pretty good idea of what the streams are like.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

That was where I was going to go with questions in terms of the size of streams.

Do they flow continuously, or do they dry up?

[Randy Clarkson]

One of the streams that is considered navigable is Henderson Creek, which is about a foot deep, or 0.3 metres deep, and about four feet wide, and of course it's much narrower and smaller in certain areas and wider in other areas. So some very small streams—streams that would only be navigable by a kayak in high-water levels—would be considered navigable under my understanding of the current definition of a vessel in the Navigable Waters Protection Act. And it's quite a surprise to these placer miners, because none of them have ever even attempted to put a boat on any of these streams.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

Okay. I was sort of under the understanding that some of those ones you're talking about wouldn't even be considered a navigable water.

[Randy Clarkson]

That's true. Transport Canada originally had a whole number of streams. Basically, every steam was tied up in licensing. And they did release a few of the very smallest streams and concluded them non-navigable. Then the Navigable Waters Protection Act does not apply to non-navigable streams.