Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Nov. 19th, 2009

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Fine. Thank you. Carry on.

[Terry Kruger]

I started off by saying how excited we are by what we're seeing and hearing from Ottawa regarding the north. Even so, we feel left out of the equation.

The NWT's hamlets, settlements, villages, towns, and cities will be profoundly affected by the decisions that will be made in the coming years. We should be granted a prominent, meaningful role in making the policy decisions that will shape the Arctic and our hometowns.

When Canada's northern strategy was unveiled this summer, the announcement took place near Ottawa. While the commitments being made are important and welcome, there is one thing missing: northern voices.

When CanNor, the new Canadian Northern Economic Development Agency, has funding programs, they go directly to communities. However, that often leaves the territorial Department of Municipal and Community Affairs in the dark, not knowing how to help the communities they're mandated to serve. This can be a challenge because many of our smaller communities depend on MACA for their support to complete application forms for federal funding programs.

Working together toward the same common goals should be the easiest barrier to overcome. However, developing a partnership with Canada, the GNWT, community governments, and aboriginal northerners having a say in their future can sometimes be one of the most challenging barriers to breach.

In closing, thank you for the time to speak with you today. We hope you remember these points as your committee gets down to work to recommend ways to tear down those barriers and develop the north.

The Mackenzie Valley Highway from Wrigley to Tuktoyaktuk needs to be built. Strong, healthy, sustainable communities are the foundation for a strong economy in the north. Federal funding using a base-plus formula that recognizes our significant challenges is necessary to build the north's future, and we want to be partners in planning the growth and development of our future.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Thank you, Mr. Kruger. We appreciate that.

Now we'll go to Mr. Ritchie. We initially said five minutes, but that was premised on the fact that we would have five panellists today. So, Mr. Ritchie, up to 10 minutes would be perfectly acceptable.

Mr. Ritchie, go ahead.

[Doug Ritchie, Member, Alternatives North]

Thank you.

Good day and welcome to the Northwest Territories. I want to start by thanking you for the opportunity to speak to you today on behalf of Alternatives North. Although my French isn't perfect, I do make an effort to speak the language. It's one way for me to honour my wife, who is from Quebec, and my in-laws. Speaking French also reminds me that a language is a gift from our ancestors. Many Aboriginals in the NWT try to preserve their own language. Unfortunately, this is a difficult, never-ending task.

Alternatives North is a social justice coalition operating in the Northwest Territories. Within our ranks are representatives of churches, labour unions, environmental organizations, women and family advocates, and anti-poverty groups. Alternatives North is known for its incredible work and analysis done largely by volunteers.

Today I want to speak about a vision. Today is my birthday, and permit me to dream out loud about what would be, to my mind, a perfect birthday present, not only for me but for my fellow citizens in the Northwest Territories.

I want to live in a territory where people can learn and relearn their traditions and languages and access services in those languages. I want to live in a territory where economic development does not mean that some people get rich and the poor get poorer. I want to live in a territory where addictions and other mental health issues are a thing of the past. I want to live in a territory where students graduate from high school with the literacy and numeracy skills to work and study anywhere they wish. I want to live in a territory where people in all communities have access to good quality, culturally appropriate day care.

Some of you may be thinking: what do these things have to do with economic development? I would say everything. Any economic development strategy would be incomplete without considering these factors. In terms of what we traditionally call economic development, I would like to see a territory that invests in the renewable resources sector and does not place all its bets on the non-renewable resource sector. I would like to live in a territory that gives people the option of living a more traditional lifestyle and working in the local economy that builds on the natural assets of the community. I would like to live in a territory where all people recognize the importance of preserving our natural capital. I would like to live in a territory that fully realizes the implications of climate change on our economic development and the need to ensure that, when we pursue economic development, we set an example for the world. If we want the world to change the way it does economic development, we must change as well.

I would be delighted to answer any questions you may have.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Thank you, Mr. Ritchie.

Gentlemen, we're going to go to our first round of questions. I don't know if you were here on the first panel, but we essentially go with a five-minute question and answer period, both for the member's question as well as your response. It is much better when we keep our questions and responses succinct and to the point.

What else do I need to tell you? We have a pre-set order of questions, and then we just follow through that order, as we typically do at committee meetings. But I would say if a question comes, even if it's not directed to you and if you have something to add, if you just signal accordingly, I'll do my best to make sure you're given some time to respond.

So let's begin with the first round, and that'll be five minutes, and we'll go to Mr. Russell.

[Todd Russell, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Good morning to each of you.

On behalf of me and I'm sure all of my colleagues, we want to wish you a happy birthday, Mr. Ritchie. Usually, I sing, but I'll speak French instead.... Anyway, happy birthday to you, and we're happy to be here in the Northwest Territories.

Just let me ask you this question. You wanted to dream about what your territory would look like. I think it's a vision that many of us would share. But how do we get there? How do we help you and other northerners, aboriginal and non-aboriginal, to get there? I think Mr. Kruger could probably join in on this because he enunciated certain good things, and then there was certainly a need there.

So perhaps you could just help us for the next minutes to go through that.

[Doug Ritchie]

Thank you very much for the question, Mr. Russell. I do appreciate it.

People from all different walks of life, different political parties, by and large agree on the vision. The real question is, what is the strategy?

One thing that comes up so often in terms of our friends in business is that they often point to business development. I think a fundamental piece of infrastructure that is needed as we pursue economic development is social infrastructure.

The north has been subject to many challenges, and I think you are aware of some of those challenges. We have to put special emphasis on developing and strengthening the social infrastructure of communities. The hard question is how we do that.

My view--and I think it is consistent with Alternatives North--is that we really do need to invest in, for example, zero to six, early childhood education. One of the challenges I have observed in terms of existing federal programs is that zero to six is a style or an emphasis for a certain number of years, and it's not followed through. I think we are starting to see some benefits from the early childhood education that has been going on, and it would be great to re-emphasize that and make it last longer.

In speaking to educators, my understanding is that one of the challenges in terms of outcomes, particularly among aboriginal students, is that with the benefit of good programs, such as Healthy Start and early childhood programs, they seem to do fairly well until grade 5, but then there's a drop-off. How do we address these drop-off issues?

I think there is room to put more cultural programming into the schools to make sure that all people are proud of who they are and where they are, as well as to enrich programs in the summertime. I don't have the evidence with me, but one of the key differences in educational outcomes of various people of different backgrounds is what they do in the summertime. School is not a 10 months a year thing; it's a 12 months a year thing. I think investing in the social infrastructure is important for northerners to take full advantage of all the economic development that is coming down the stream. Human capital investment, human infrastructure investment, is as important as the physical infrastructure investment.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

You have 30 seconds.

[Todd Russell, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

I'll leave it to Mr. Kruger.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Do you want to add something?

[Terry Kruger]

I just want to reinforce the notion that community public infrastructure is important: for example, water plants; recreation facilities; communities with indoor skating rinks and concrete floors, where they can have artificial ice and you don't have to wait until December or January--things that make communities healthy places where people want to live and stay and where people want to come to work and stay.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Thank you, Mr. Russell.

You have five minutes, Mr. Lévesque.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'd like to begin by wishing Mr. Ritchie a happy birthday and by thanking him for making an effort to honour his in-laws. Unfortunately, Quebeckers are generally not familiar with the NWT. We cannot begin to imagine where communities that are accessible by road are located. My colleague Mr. Bagnell gave me a map of the NWT yesterday, but there isn't enough room to spread it out in front of us.

My riding encompasses James Bay and Nunavik. There are no roads in Nunavik. The problem is the same, if not worse, here in the NWT. I imagine that one road cuts through the area and that byways should be built to make villages accessible. That is not the case in Nunavik, but it is true in James Bay. A major roadway cuts through the territories and byways connect to villages.

Would the highway that you are referring to be located close enough to the byways to make them reasonably accessible?

[Doug Ritchie]

At Alternatives North we have not thought a lot about the Mackenzie Valley in terms of the highway, but I think the question we would ask.... One of the things we often refuse to do is join bandwagons; we like to have solid thinking on these issues. While we certainly respect the wishes of people in the valley, I do want to pose this question to them: what is the most effective way of trying to get those gains they want?

I think there's a rationale for the roads, but I personally want people to make sure they recognize that there are benefits and problems with the roads. So I would argue that people should make sure they are careful what they wish for and that they look at alternative ways of achieving those same things. That would be my only comment with respect to the roads.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

Would Mr. Kruger care to comment?

[Terry Kruger]

Our communities have supported finishing the Mackenzie Valley Highway because that transportation link is critical.

Let's take the construction season. If you order parts or pieces for a new gymnasium, they will be shipped in sometime during the summer on a barge, laid down, and you probably won't be able to work until the following summer. You have to transport all of your fuel at one time. Tourism is based on people flying in. It just raises the cost of living, and building a highway is essential to lowering the cost of living and providing that connectivity between communities. You're not going to build highways or roads to every community, as I noted, but it's an essential piece of the infrastructure to develop the northern economy.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

That is not what I was getting at with my question. You talked about a highway, a main route cutting through the region. Obviously, every hamlet or village that you mention will not necessarily be close to this main highway. I'm curious about how far away from these communities the highway would be.

Once construction of this main highway is completed, how far will people have to travel on average to get to the various settlements and communities?

[Terry Kruger]

I can't tell you exact kilometres. I would imagine if you build the Mackenzie Valley Highway to the Dempster Highway, the distance from the highway to somewhere like Colville Lake could be 100 kilometres, 200 kilometres. I'm not exactly sure.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

I see. It will have to wait until next time.

Now we'll go to Mr. Bevington. I should also recognize, of course, that we're in the riding of Western Arctic. I still don't know why we call it Western.... Well, I know why we call it Western Arctic, but it doesn't seem to jibe with the other territorial riding names.

I know Mr. Bevington was helpful to our committee with the witness list, and we appreciate that.

So it's good to be here in your riding, Dennis, and now you have five minutes.

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Western Arctic, NT]

Well, Mr. Chair, that may be one of the recommendations this committee could make, to get unanimous consent of the House of Commons to change the name of the riding. I've been after that for almost four years, because it really is inappropriate. Western Arctic...there's no validity to Western Arctic after division occurred. When we had one territory, we had an Eastern Arctic and a Western Arctic riding. After division, Nunavut took the name that was proper for it, and for some reason, this was left out by Parliament. So I would appreciate your support in that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

We're off topic here, I know, but does it go back to 1993 then with the creation of Nunavut?

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Western Arctic, NT]

It was 1999.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Oh, 1999.

[Dennis Bevington, NDP, Western Arctic, NT]

That's correct. It was not done at that time and that's an unfortunate thing. I would love to see this committee recommend that, because true recognition of the north is something that would also support northern development.

I appreciate both of the presentations here today. Cost of living is huge in the north, and I know that any vision for the north must find a way to create sustainable communities.

Mr. Kruger, you've talked about roads and you've talked about the $1.8 billion Mackenzie Highway. But in fact, to link the rest of the communities to a road would not really require that expenditure right away. The $1.8 billion speaks to a highway from Wrigley to Tuk, but to connect the rest of the communities in the north doesn't actually require that whole road to be built at once. We need a road to Norman Wells and into the Sahtu region, and we need a road to Tuktoyaktuk. Is that not correct? That would link all the communities that are now not on a road system with the extension within the Sahtu to the regional communities.

[Terry Kruger]

The resolution that our communities passed called for completion of the highway. Forgive me, I don't remember the exact wording, but I know a previous resolution called for the Mackenzie Highway to be completed in stages, as envisioned in the early seventies. They would build from Wrigley to Tulita, Tulita to Norman Wells, Norman Wells to Fort Good Hope, then to the Dempster near Fort McPherson. So it could be done in stages.