Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Nov. 26th, 2009

[Don Head]

The last time we met was in early summer. We've had three meetings in the last year.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

That's definitely an improvement. There had been a long hiatus—

[Don Head]

That's right.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

—when the committee hadn't met.

So you've met three times in the last year.

[Don Head]

Yes. Our next meeting is in January, and then I think the next one after that may be in March.

As an example, we held our last meeting in Iqaluit, and it was an opportunity for us to engage representatives from the Nunavut government and the community to talk about northern corrections issues.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

You mentioned your accountability framework, and I know that the correctional investigator highlighted some challenges. He said the correctional service does not have the necessary data collection systems in place to monitor and evaluate its progress in the area of aboriginal commissions. They go on to say that they've been recommending quarterly reports, analyzing key correctional outcomes, and so on. He lists a whole gamut. He indicated that an integrated monitoring system was to be in place by March 2007. This date has long passed.

Have you changed the reporting requirements, and are you going to be gathering on a quarterly basis and reporting on a quarterly basis things like transfers, segregation, discipline, temporary absences, and all of that?

[Don Head]

Yes, very much so. We have a document now that we just published in September, which we call the aboriginal offenders “Milestones” document.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

So that's publicly available?

[Don Head]

We haven't put it up on our website, but it is a document that we can make available to this committee.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

I would appreciate a copy of that.

[Don Head]

Yes.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

I think that would help in terms of the committee's being able to assess whether there's been progress.

You mentioned in your speech that the trend toward shorter sentences seriously limits the time available for CSC to provide access to programs. Yet I noted in the issues around security and classification that placement in maximum security institutions and segregation limit increased interventions that are available in lower security, and the correctional investigator pointed out that 45% of federally sentenced in maximum security are women. If people are in maximum security and they're limited in the kinds of programs.... I just wonder how that fits into the context of your saying that it seriously limits the time available to provide programs and services.

You have people who are in maximum security. They don't have access. You're talking about the fact that it's important for them to have access. How do you line that up?

[Don Head]

It's a very good question. That's one of the things we're trying to reconcile now. It's one of the reasons that we're moving very quickly on the introduction of what I mentioned briefly, the integrated correctional program model, which will allow us to deliver and to start offender engagement in programs much earlier in their sentence.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

Including maximum security?

[Don Head]

Including maximum security. In some cases, it would be starting that program right during the time of reception, when they're sitting in the reception units.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

If there were one thing that the committee could do to help you in your job, what would that be?

[Don Head]

I think it goes back to the question that was raised by Mr. Bagnell earlier, and that is really about the back end of the system. As I mentioned, I classify us as being the back end of the criminal justice system. But with the work that we've been doing around programs, the efficacy of those programs, the research that's showing that these programs work when they are delivered and we get them up, we need the new back end of that system to support those offenders when they go back out in the community.

I'd like to be able to say that I proclaim myself to be the front end of a new system that is able to support offenders once they've reached warrant expiry and to build on the learning, the programs, and the interventions that they were able to participate in within our system to help sustain them out in the community in a law-abiding way.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

Do I have more time?

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

One minute, Ms. Crowder.

[Jean Crowder, NDP, Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC]

I think most of us would agree that back-end support is really important, because reintegration into community in a healthy, safe way will help keep people from reoffending.

On the protocol, I think you probably know I mentioned the protocol with regard to handling women offenders who are high-risk. I understand that there are some changes coming to that. When can we expect to see changes to that protocol?

[Don Head]

I hope to have that within this fiscal year, to have the proposal in place. The management protocol, I think, was a response to some very challenging and difficult cases. It's been in place, and I think it's been pointed out that there are some difficulties with that. I recognize those difficulties, and I've asked our staff to look at how we address those in a way that is actually more progressive and looks at moving women back into a general population mode so that they can access interventions and opportunities like the rest of the women.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

You're right on time. Thank you, Ms. Crowder and Mr. Head.

Now we'll go to Mr. Duncan, for seven minutes.

Mr. Duncan, go ahead.

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Head, thank you for your testimony.

It was nice to hear from our Liberal colleague from the Yukon that the previous administration was an absolute failure in terms of dealing with crime in the north over 13 years.

Well, he took a lot of shots at us, and I'm going to do the same with him.

I have many first nations in my riding. I've talked to community leaders and I've been involved in first nations issues nationally over at least the last 15 years. The issue that my colleague Mr. Clarke brought up previously, which is aboriginal crime against aboriginal within their own community, is a growing concern. Much of the leadership is quite concerned.

A lot of this is no surprise to you, I'm sure. It's drug-related, and of course we have the huge population increase in youth.

So you're at the sharp end and you have a very difficult task, and I commend you for your progressive initiatives, which you've talked about today, to try to make things better. When you talked about your comprehensive response and the accountability framework that has come into play this year, which integrates all aspects of corrections planning, operations, reporting, and accountability, would it be fair to say it would be very difficult to operate without doing that at this point, given the makeup of the population?

[Don Head]

It's a very good question. In order for us to make any inroads as it relates to aboriginal offenders, we need to have a very strong integrated approach, and that's what we're doing within the Correctional Service of Canada.

At the end of the day, as I mentioned earlier in my testimony, it's extremely important that in the long run we find just as equally effective an integrated approach from the beginning of the criminal justice system to well beyond the criminal justice system. That's when we'll see long-term changes in terms of the issue that we're talking about today.

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

You did also mention that your department is viewed very positively, I think ranked number two in terms of aboriginal participation in your workforce. Is that a recent change or has that developed over time?