Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Dec. 8th, 2009

[Ian D. Robertson]

Quickly, with respect to land use planning, if there is no settled land claim, we don't do regional planning there, because they must have signed an agreement under the Umbrella Final Agreement. Until then, we can't go there. Even if there is a lot of pressure for it, we can't go there.

[Todd Russell, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

You made the comment, Mr. Robertson, that the land use plan is the front end of the process and YESAA is the back end. If you're saying the front end is not efficient enough or we don't have the resources--

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

Choose your words carefully.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Todd Russell, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

--or the people resources to do that work and it is integral to YESAA's process, what does it say about the integrity of YESAA itself in carrying out its particular mandate?

[Ian D. Robertson]

I think we have to recognize that there is consensus in that we think YESAA has done a remarkable job. All the first nations agree, whether they are settled or not, that the YESAA process works and having a Yukon-based process works.

The real issue here is that we're not carrying our end of this, and we're not carrying our end of this partly because there's a bunch of disconnects. The disconnects go right back to the political commitment to get planning done, to the quality of the information we use to prepare the plans, and to whether or not everybody will come to the table and participate. If people don't want to participate, the process gets blocked.

Where it's going to get really interesting is in the case of this new Peel plan, which is recommending that up to 80% of a large area be set aside as special management areas. That is being perceived by industry as a significant negative, but the argument the planning commission is making is that in this situation, in this particular region, the weighting should be on the conservation side as opposed to being on the development side of the equation. But we don't know whether there is the political will to follow through on that recommendation.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

That's about all the time you have. We have about 15 seconds if you have a short one-word answer type of question.

Go ahead. Now you have 10 seconds.

[Todd Russell, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

On the land use planning side, it's basically a land claims implementation issue. Is that right?

[Ian D. Robertson]

Yes, it is.

[Todd Russell, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

Are all levels of government living up to the spirit and intent of the land claim agreements?

[Ian D. Robertson]

Absolutely.

[Todd Russell, Liberal, Labrador, NL]

Okay.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

That was good.

Now we will go to Mr. Duncan for five minutes.

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

Correct me if I'm mistaken, but the McCrank review had only one Yukon-specific recommendation, and that one recommendation was related to this five-year YESAA review that you referenced, Mr. Robertson. Do you anticipate that this review is near completion? Is there anything significant that the review will enlighten us on?

[Ian D. Robertson]

There are two reviews. There is the five-year review specific to YESAA, which Stephen can speak to. There is the nine-year overall implementation review of the land claims implementation, from which we get our funding.

I'm hoping they will increase the requirement for accountability by everyone as part of the funding agreements that come out of this. I'm also hoping that they will increasingly recognize that things like climate change have significant impacts on the north in terms of land use planning and then will start putting more money into basic science, because we can't produce good plans without having good science to work from.

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

Thank you.

With the economic action plan, there was a windfall in the science area for the north, I understand. I hope that will partially address your concerns.

It would constitute good news and is a testimony to the good example the Yukon is setting that only one recommendation from McCrank addressed the Yukon. That goes without saying, but it is worth stating for the record here.

You look as if you want to respond, Stephen.

[Stephen Mills]

We met with Mr. McCrank and gave him an overview of the YESAA process. We were quite pleased with the report that came forward.

You asked about the five-year review. I think there will be some changes, but I don't think system-wide changes are going to be coming forward. I think they're going to be fairly minor in nature, with changes to YESAA to maybe catch a few issues but not try to overhaul that system. I don't think we'd want to see that.

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

Thank you.

When we were in Whitehorse, we heard from the Klondike Placer Miners' Association. They had a real concern about working with the Navigable Waters Protection Act. They have an agreement in place already with DFO, an MOU with DFO, specific to placer mining. They made a request through our committee to have something similar set up with the Department of Transport specific to placer mining.

I'm wondering if this is a bigger issue than placer mining and, if so, if it could be addressed through that kind of mechanism. I'm not sure who best to address this question to. Perhaps Mr. McKinnon...?

[Stephen Mills]

If I may answer...? Thank you.

It's a bigger issue that just the placer mining. One the designation on what is a navigable water, but also, another one is the late decision that's made sometimes. I think the Transport Canada issue is just a bigger issue, that is, having them in the process earlier for assessment or anything else so that they identify themselves as a regulator on a particular project.

So it's a bigger issue. It happens. We've had the same issue on quartz mining, on exploration activities, and on almost any project: it's the could/might trigger. Anything that's close to a stream of any size might trigger a Transport Canada sort of process, but as I've said before, we are having some difficulty in getting early engagement from those officials.

[John Duncan, Conservative, Vancouver Island North, BC]

There was an earlier line of questioning here having to do with the process on unsettled claim lands. I'm just wondering if the timelines remain the same on those lands or if the timelines don't apply.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Make that a short answer, if you could.

[Stephen Mills]

I can give you a short answer. All the timelines are the same. The only difference is that there's a bit of extra time for a federal or territorial decision body to consult with the first nation that is not settled before they issue a decision document. That's the only difference.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Thank you, Mr. Duncan and Mr. Mills.

You have the floor for five minutes, Mr. Lévesque. After that, we will go to Mr. Payne and to Ms. Crowder.

[Yvon Lévesque, Bloc, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Good day, gentlemen.

This was my very first visit to the Yukon and I truly appreciated the experience. I understand what Mr. McKinnon is saying when he talks about Stephen's negotiating skills. He is also very good at delivering on his promises. We received some very nice caps during our visit and I'd like to take this opportunity to thank Stephen.

I believe Mr. Robertson mentioned the Peel River drainage basin. Regarding this project, what kind of consultations did the commission hold in order to come up with the plan that is being recommended?

[Ian D. Robertson]

I should clarify that the council is not involved directly in the planning that's done by an independent commission. The commission solicits input from all possible stakeholders, and that includes going to all the communities. Not that there are a lot of communities, but they do visit all the communities. They invite industry associations and specific companies that have interests in an area to participate in the process and to present their views on what would be an appropriate regional plan and that type of thing.