Evidence of meeting #13 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 40th Parliament, 3rd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was program.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Director General, Community Programs Directorate, First Nations and Inuit Health Branch, Department of Health
Anybody in any community who's eligible under the settlement agreement has access to this program. It--
Liberal
Larry Bagnell Liberal Yukon, YT
So in spite of the fact that we're being cut from $25 million a year to $10 million, you're going to add all this travel across Canada out of that limited amount of money. There will be even less services than 40%.
Director General, Community Programs Directorate, First Nations and Inuit Health Branch, Department of Health
Well, we are trying to find efficiencies by looking at where the healing foundation projects were offered and where we didn't have a presence--
Liberal
Director General, Community Programs Directorate, First Nations and Inuit Health Branch, Department of Health
Absolutely not. I think the efficiencies are in the way that you describe all these costs. What we're going to try to do is cut down on travel costs by looking at the Aboriginal Healing Foundation projects and saying, “This makes sense for us to actually enter into a contribution agreement with a local organization because there are enough former students and family members to justify a project, according to our criteria”. Then we would enter into a contribution agreement. So we wouldn't be flying people all over the country.
It's efficiencies in our program that I was meaning--not in comparison to the Aboriginal Healing Foundation.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton
All right then.
We will now hear from either Mr. Lévesque or Ms. Deschamps.
Go ahead then, Mr. Lévesque.
Bloc
Yvon Lévesque Bloc Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC
Good day, ladies. I say ladies, because all of our witnesses today happen to be women.
As you know, things work a little differently in Quebec. Your report does not contain any statistics on the Inuit of Nunavik, or on the James Bay Cree.
Have you entered into agreements of some kind with the provincial government, or do you deal directly with the communities in order to manage the program?
Director General, Community Programs Directorate, First Nations and Inuit Health Branch, Department of Health
In Quebec's case, we have a total of 19 contribution agreements with provincial organizations. I believe we are also in the process of concluding an agreement with Nunavik—and we'll monitor these developments—and one with the Cree as well. We are in discussion with officials from the Cree Board of Health and Social Services, which serves Mistissini, Waswanipi, Chisasibi and Eastmain. We are concluding contribution agreements with these organizations as part of our program.
Bloc
Yvon Lévesque Bloc Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC
So then at this point in time, there are no actual agreements in place. You note on page 5 of your report, Ms. Langlois, that the deadline for completing projects funded by the Aboriginal Healing Foundation is March 31. That deadline has already passed.
Will other initiatives be considered, or was that date merely the deadline for submitting projects that will be carried out at a later date?
Director General, Community Programs Directorate, First Nations and Inuit Health Branch, Department of Health
As a matter of fact, we are in discussion to secure contribution agreements. So then, it is possible that we might encounter some service delays at this time.
Bloc
Johanne Deschamps Bloc Laurentides—Labelle, QC
This is the first time I have attended a meeting of this committee, so my question might seem somewhat simplistic to you.
What conditions must be present in order for a claim to be reconsidered? Is the applicant in fact the one who requests a review of his claim? I see that a number of requests for reconsideration have been made.
Director General, Community Programs Directorate, First Nations and Inuit Health Branch, Department of Health
I don't understand your question about requests for reconsideration.
Bloc
Johanne Deschamps Bloc Laurentides—Labelle, QC
Can a person ask that his claim be reconsidered, for various reasons unbeknownst to me? I'm not sure if you were the one who mentioned it, but we heard that 24,500 requests for reconsideration had been received. That's quite an impressive number.
Director General, Settlement Agreement Policy and Partnerships, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Yes. There has been.... In 2006, a year after we started implementing the common experience payments, the courts decided to add a step in the appeals process. Applicants who have had their applications denied for various reasons can go to the national administrative commission, or committee, for an appeal. The courts added a step before that called reconsideration, during which they apply to INAC. It's an internal INAC process.
They ask us to take another look at their claim. They provide us with two additional pieces of information, and that can be about the school they went to, their teachers, their classmates, just something to help us verify the claim that they did in fact go during the time period that they said they went. It's just an extra step in the appeal process before it goes to the national administrative committee.
Bloc
Johanne Deschamps Bloc Laurentides—Labelle, QC
The fact is that people have been receiving help from the Foundation for many years now, for at least 12 years, if not more. As of the end of March, the Foundation is no longer receiving any funding. This could create some confusion for the aboriginal population that is accustomed to working with the Foundation. Even though you work to get a lot of information out to them, there will probably be some confusion for a while, as people wonder who they can turn to for assistance. The Foundation was an independent body but now, people will have to turn to the government.
Director General, Settlement Agreement Policy and Partnerships, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Mr. Chair, there's some confusion between the Aboriginal Healing Foundation, which was delivering healing supports to survivors, and the common experience payment process, which is a payment for individuals who went to residential schools. It pays them, based on a formula, for their experience--their loss of language and culture at the schools. That's what the reconsideration process is for. It has nothing to do with the Aboriginal Healing Foundation.
The Aboriginal Healing Foundation is a separate part of the settlement agreement. It was provided with $125 million. My colleague from Health Canada is speaking about the process they're going through to try to ensure that clients who have been receiving services under the healing foundation are now able to get services through Health Canada. That's a separate part of the settlement agreement.
Director General, Community Programs Directorate, First Nations and Inuit Health Branch, Department of Health
Mr. Chair, I would add that as individuals are going through the reconsideration process, because that does tend to cause some needs for mental health and emotional supports, our program is there to support them. Our program is available.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton
Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Deschamps.
Now let's go to Ms. Crowder.
Thank you for helping us with that little technical problem. I think we're okay now.
Go ahead, Ms. Crowder, for seven minutes.
NDP
Jean Crowder NDP Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC
Thanks, Mr. Chair.
I want to thank the witnesses for coming today.
When I was reviewing things like the annual report from the Aboriginal Healing Foundation and other material, it seemed evident that the mandate of the Aboriginal Healing Foundation was to have community-based healing projects in place. When I look at the mandate of the Health Canada program, it appears very much individually driven. Based on that, it seems that they have two separate focuses.
I'm not clear on how you think the Health Canada program is going to replace that community-based initiative. It's not evident to me in the presentation you made, nor in the Health Canada information.
Director General, Settlement Agreement Policy and Partnerships, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Do you want to explain your program and the differences?
Director General, Community Programs Directorate, First Nations and Inuit Health Branch, Department of Health
Sure. Our program is individual- and family-based for those who are eligible under the residential settlement agreement to receive our services. When we work in a contribution agreement setting, it's possible to do group counselling as well.
However, you should appreciate we are not going to be able to go as far as the community-based types of approaches that the healing foundations had. Nonetheless--
NDP
Jean Crowder NDP Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC
It's clearly going to be a different approach in terms of healing. I want to just come back to the Health Canada site for a second, because you've outlined that it would be a former student, regardless of status or place and all those kinds of things. Then I see that they have to call the health regional office, so already they don't have local community support. They're going to be calling a 1-800 number.
I don't know what your experience has been, but my experience has been that in many of these rural or remote communities telephone access is uncertain sometimes, and calling a 1-800 number is not the way people who may or may not be in crisis will reach out.
So they'll call a 1-800 number and they'll have their counsellor or therapist submit a treatment plan. Of course, that's presuming that they have a counsellor or therapist in their community. That will include the number of sessions and costs of treatment, developed based on an assessment of your needs, obtaining approval from Health Canada before treatment begins, and so on.
I guess what I'm seeing is that rather than it being community-based, where someone can go into their local centre and get immediate assistance, they're going to phone a number and get referred to a counsellor who may or may not live in the area. Then there's a transportation issue in terms of them having to leave the community.
And to determine whether there's a treatment plan that's going to be acceptable to Health Canada..... Again, with respect, in regard to other professionals who are dealing with Health Canada, some of those professionals are withdrawing their services because of the rigmarole they have to go through in order to be paid by Health Canada: dentists, pharmacists....
So explain to me how this is going to meet a community-based approach for people who may or may not be in crisis.
Director General, Community Programs Directorate, First Nations and Inuit Health Branch, Department of Health
What you've described represents about 13% of the spending in our program. Fully two-thirds of the spending in our program is for resolution health support workers and cultural service providers, that is, elders and traditional healers.
NDP
Jean Crowder NDP Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC
So you're saying those people will be on the ground and able to respond immediately.
Director General, Community Programs Directorate, First Nations and Inuit Health Branch, Department of Health
What I'm saying is that if an individual needs to connect to the program and has not already connected to it, they may find out about their program in their community from their nursing station, from the NNADAP worker, or from the other community workers in the community. To connect to the program, they do need to call the regional office, but the regional office will put them in contact if they say they want to see an elder. The regional office will assess whether there are elder services already in that community. If not, they'll try to connect them up.
Where there's a critical mass of a demand, such as we are seeing now with the loss of the Aboriginal Healing Foundation projects, we are prepared to enter into contribution agreements to provide those services locally.