Evidence of meeting #16 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was use.
A recording is available from Parliament.
NDP
Dennis Bevington NDP Western Arctic, NT
Aren't wood pellets one of the more successful potentials in Canada? Don't we have quite a large supply that has not yet been put on the market, in terms of wood waste from a variety of plants across the country?
Executive Director, Canadian Association for Renewable Energies
My understanding is that north of 60, trees are not--
NDP
Dennis Bevington NDP Western Arctic, NT
No, I'm not talking about north of 60. We're shipping these things to the north. We ship fuel oil; if we don't ship fuel oil, we can ship these other things.
Executive Director, Canadian Association for Renewable Energies
There's a higher energy content per litre of oil than per litre of wood chips. You may actually increase transportation costs to get it up there, but I totally agree with you.
NDP
Dennis Bevington NDP Western Arctic, NT
The studies show that they can ship it there at a saving, compared to fuel oil.
Executive Director, Canadian Association for Renewable Energies
Yes. If it is cost effective or even slightly subsidized, then go for it.
Executive Director, Canadian Association for Renewable Energies
There is no reason to use oil in that situation.
NDP
Dennis Bevington NDP Western Arctic, NT
But is there a federal program that can help with this? That's my concern.
We have a need in the forest industry for the sale of more of their products. This is a waste product from the forest industry. We have a ready market right across the country for people who burn fuel oil right now. I don't think you could make the case for a natural gas pipeline that would be cheaper than wood pellets, but I think it is very much the case right across the country wherever you burn fuel oil.
Executive Director, Canadian Association for Renewable Energies
My understanding is there are direct and indirect subsidies for the transport of oil to the north. Why not have direct and indirect subsidies to transport wood pellets to the north?
Executive Director, Canadian Association for Renewable Energies
I'm not aware of one. I'm sorry, but it's not my field of expertise. I don't know about transportation subsidies, but it's certainly something this committee could investigate and recommend.
Conservative
NDP
Dennis Bevington NDP Western Arctic, NT
Okay. I think that solar clearly works up north. There are many examples of it, as you pointed out. I think we're trying to find some answers on how to make the transition.
The problem we identified in the north for putting solar on buildings is that the utility companies in the small isolated grids do not want solar on the buildings, because it takes customers away from their diesel generator sets. Perhaps you could talk a little about what's needed there.
Executive Director, Canadian Association for Renewable Energies
You are correct. Engineers despise distributed generation because it messes up their load profiles; engineers like predictability.
One of the reasons for the high subsidy of solar PV in Ontario is because Ontario is now a cooling load province. We need more electricity in the middle of summer than we do in the middle of winter, and the best technology for generating electricity at noon during the summer months is solar PV. That will stop Toronto from blacking out in four years; that's why the province is throwing millions of dollars into it.
If it works in the Arctic, and it does, at all of the sites I've seen.... We were involved with the Weledeh school. There solar displaces I forget how many barrels of oil for the high school in Yellowknife, and it works extremely well heating air. It's not even heating water, which is a more practical approach. We've argued that like Cyprus, like Malta, like Israel.... Many countries have solar laws that you must use solar if it makes economic sense.
NDP
Dennis Bevington NDP Western Arctic, NT
There's just one last thing. Are there any small biomass generating systems that you want to promote here for isolated communities?
Executive Director, Canadian Association for Renewable Energies
There are quite a few. As you say, as long as you've got the feedstock--
NDP
Dennis Bevington NDP Western Arctic, NT
Could you give an example of one in Canada that would be viable for a community of 200 to 300 people?
Executive Director, Canadian Association for Renewable Energies
I can get back to you with the specific brands and companies. I'm aware of probably 50 that sell small systems, meaning between one kilowatt and 10 kilowatts, and there are probably more. You can build them modularly, and those systems would be able to generate the majority of the electricity for those communities. Again, do you need electricity or do you need heat?
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Bruce Stanton
Thank you very much, Mr. Bevington.
I had Mr. Payne and Mr. Duncan. Did you want to split your time?
We'll go with Mr. Payne, and if there's some time left, we'll go back to Mr. Duncan.
Let's go with Mr. Payne first.
Conservative
LaVar Payne Conservative Medicine Hat, AB
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I'd like to welcome you on behalf of all of my colleagues, Mr. Eggertson.
You'll have to forgive me, because I'm not sure I've heard of the Canadian Association for Renewable Energies. I'm wondering if you can help me out in telling me a bit about the organization, what you do, where you get your funding, and what your outcomes are.
I'll let you work on those for a moment.
Executive Director, Canadian Association for Renewable Energies
It was formed in the late 1990s. Originally it was to be an umbrella group for wind energy, the solar industry, SESCI, earth energy, and groups like that, because they were all pushing their own specific widgets or technology, and there was the need for an umbrella, an overarching group, to push renewables as a concept, as opposed to pushing, for instance, wind turbines. It was to be one for all and all for one, or whatever the saying is.
We have been financed in the past with members who agree with the approach. The trouble is that many companies are into wind only; they don't cross technology. You don't push both wind turbines and solar thermal. Those were the only types of members we had, so we were supported through contracts for writing.
I think we are still the largest news service in the country on renewables in Canada, but a lot of our income now comes from offshore. We do reports for U.S. and U.K. clients on the energy scenario in Canada. We use our contacts with the renewable energy sector to say what the market opportunities are in this country, where you should move into, where you should stay out of, what the incentives are, and what regulations are good or bad for investors coming in.
We are in a restart mode, because I was gone for two and a half years with the U.K. government, on climate change. I've just recently come back. During that time the organization went somewhat into limbo, so we're now reactivating it, along with some other services.
Conservative
LaVar Payne Conservative Medicine Hat, AB
Are you providing reports to these other organizations on investments and opportunities?