Evidence of meeting #47 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was money.
A video is available from Parliament.
9:50 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal MaryAnn Mihychuk
That was completely my mistake. I'm sorry. Please go ahead with the deck that you have.
9:50 a.m.
Deputy Minister, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Okay. I will ask Mr. Thoppil to do that for us. Thank you.
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Liberal
9:50 a.m.
Voices
Oh, oh!
9:50 a.m.
Liberal
9:50 a.m.
Chief Financial Officer, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Thank you, Madame Chair.
What the department has tried to do to provide more clarity with regard to the supplementary estimates is to prepare this PowerPoint presentation to address potential anticipated questions.
What we have in front of us, moving to page 2, is essentially how much we have been given by Parliament to date in terms of authorities, and then what the supplementary estimates provide us with. So what you will see on page 2 is essentially that, net of transfers and other adjustments. We are seeking parliamentary authority for an additional $92 million, to take us to the $9.5 billion amount.
Page 3 essentially breaks down, in a summary way, the amounts that we are requesting by key initiative, and it also tries to provide you with how that relates by vote. As the minister noted in her remarks, vote 1 is for certain purposes vis-à-vis vote 10. Vote 10, as you know, is for grants and contributions for recipients, versus vote 1, which is for salaries and operating dollars.
Page 4 is an attempt to try to deal with questions that were posed by members on the rationale for the $56 million in additional emergency-related costs beyond what we have in the department's existing reference levels. The minister cited a number of examples of events for which we had already issued a reimbursement. Now we are seeking parliamentary authority for reimbursement to cover those costs from a departmental basis, and to ensure that we're within the authorities granted to us by the parliament.
Page 5 just tries to provide you with a bit of a picture of some of those costs that are being reimbursed. This is an example of the effort to try to build back Kashechewan after the flooding, showing some of the homes. You will note that it is an example of a home without a basement, thus dealing with the reality of the ground there, whereas the ones that were in Kashechewan before the flood all had basements and, therefore, suffered from the flooding.
Page 6 is our request for additional funds related to the operation return home project. This is a multi-year engagement to ensure that we repair, rebuild, and re-establish the four Manitoba first nations that, unfortunately, were significantly impacted by severe flooding in 2011. We are anticipating a return of all the evacuees to the four first nations communities by 2018-19.
What you have then, following page 6, are photographs of the progress being made across those four first nations communities. We are providing the necessary infrastructure so that when the evacuees do return, they will have their homes, their roads, their water treatment plants, and sewage systems consistent with the community, and to ensure that it's functioning.
Page 8 is essentially a request for $10 million to ensure the continued negotiations between Canada, the Province of Ontario, and seven Williams Treaty first nations. This is essentially consistent with the minister's direction not to litigate but to negotiate out of the Alderville litigation that was filed in 1992.
I believe that page 9 was adequately addressed based on the questions between members and the minister with regard to the purpose of the $3 million for indigenous childhood claims litigation. As the minister stated, it is essentially for research and analysis to ensure that when we do negotiate, we are dealing with appropriate class sizes, and that we rectify appropriately the wrongs that were done in the past.
Page 10 is some background on what is essentially the purposes of the Arctic regional environmental studies, and you will note, on page 11, some examples of committee engagements in the past in similar areas related to environmental studies.
Finally, this is essentially the provision of languages for the 11 self-governing Yukon first nations that Mr. McLeod mentioned, and that is consistent with their self-governing agreements.
That's it for the presentation. I'm happy to address, along with my colleagues, any questions that you may have.
10 a.m.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative David Yurdiga
Thank you for the presentation.
We're going to go into our seven-minute round, starting with Michael McLeod.
10 a.m.
Liberal
Michael McLeod Liberal Northwest Territories, NT
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I have two lines of questioning. The first one is an ongoing concern that I have about consistent funding for aboriginal people across the board. I think I've raised it a number of times with you.
I wanted to get some reassurance that the department is investing in aboriginal people in a fair way, whether on reserve, off reserve, or south of the border—whether it's in the communities in the southern provinces or in the communities in the north. Explain to me how your mandate allows you to do that. Indigenous Affairs seems to be focused and mandated only on reserves, and reserves in the south. The reserves in my riding keep telling me that they don't qualify for on-reserve funding, even though they are federal reserves. They're being told that they should get a territorial government, but they're federal reserves. We don't qualify, as I pointed out, for a whole slew of program announcements that were made by this government.
Can you just explain to me how we do that without actually going to an audit to see how fair the funding is? Are the people in my riding being provided with the same money per capita as other jurisdictions?
10 a.m.
Deputy Minister, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
I will start, and then I'll turn to my colleague, Mr. Thoppil, on that.
There are different entry points for providing funding for indigenous people, and it is quite true that for the Indian bands that are governed by the Indian Act, there is a certain type of funding agreement that is quite formula-driven and is similar, depending on the various sizes of population. There are other entry points, depending on whether there is a land claim agreement or a self-government agreement, or whether indigenous people live off reserve or in urban areas, but there is programming to actually support them.
With respect to being able to give you a specific picture as to whether or not exactly the same dollars are going to everybody, I would point out that in the case of the north, there are different arrangements with the territories. So it wouldn't be adequate to give an identical breakdown per capita, as you're asking. However, what we could do for you is to provide you with information about all the funding that goes particularly to the Northwest Territories, or north of 60 in general, and which entry door that funding flows.
Paul, would you like to add anything?
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Chief Financial Officer, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
No, I think the—
10 a.m.
Liberal
Michael McLeod Liberal Northwest Territories, NT
Yes, I would very much appreciate that. I've been struggling with the issue and trying to confirm for my constituents that we're being funded in a fair manner and on par with other communities. I'm not getting that. I am not hearing that we are receiving equal funding.
I've talked to the territorial government. They've reassured me that there isn't a special arrangement, that there is no special mention of aboriginal responsibility in their funding formulas. I would appreciate it if you could tell me, maybe through a graph, how we are funded on par. I'd appreciate it if we could dig down a little deeper—maybe not right now but as we move forward.
In all fairness, I have to demonstrate that I'm representing my communities, and funding is an important part. If we're not getting housing money when everybody else is getting aboriginal housing money, if we're not getting health and education money, all of these different things that are being provided across the country and we don't qualify in the north.... Nunavut is a good example too. They don't get the same kind of monies that the reserves are getting. I'd like to have further information, if you could provide that to me.
In this supplementary request, you pointed out at one point that there's $1.8 million for the studies that we're finally going to undertake. I think the request and desire to move forward on that has been there for a while. The overall anticipated budget is $19 million over five years. Is there a plan attached to that? Can I see some information on when the money's going to be rolled out, in what areas? Do we have a budget, a breakout, an action plan? This has generated a lot of interest, and a lot of questions are coming my way. I'd like to be more specific.
10:05 a.m.
Chief Financial Officer, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Thank you for the question.
This money is going to be used to help assess the potential environmental impacts of future oil and gas activity in three regions of the Arctic: the Beaufort-Mackenzie Basin; Baffin Bay and Davis Strait; Kivalliq and Kitikmeot and the Arctic islands of Nunavut. The funds will be used to support a Baffin Bay and Davis Strait strategic environmental assessment, and the Beaufort regional strategic environmental assessment.
These assessments will form a significant part of the science-based review of the decision to designate the Canadian Arctic waters as indefinitely off-limits to new offshore oil and gas licences, as per the United States–Canada joint Arctic leaders' statement of December 20.
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Liberal
Michael McLeod Liberal Northwest Territories, NT
Madam Chair, I see that in the document and recognize it. That's not what I'm asking you. I'm asking you for an action plan, the breakout. You have three areas of study. How much of that is coming forward? Out of the $1.8 million that's being requested now, does that have to be spent before the end of March?
10:05 a.m.
Chief Financial Officer, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
It does, and—
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Liberal
10:05 a.m.
Chief Financial Officer, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
—if it doesn't, we will seek to re-profile it for the future, with the support of the central agencies, so that it does not get lost.
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Chief Financial Officer, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
As for the action plan, we can come back to you with some details with regard to how, and the breakout of the work plan associated with the spending of the $19 million.
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Liberal
Michael McLeod Liberal Northwest Territories, NT
I'd like to see the whole work plan, if I could, but more specifically for the western Arctic.
10:05 a.m.
Chief Financial Officer, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
Okay, we will do that.
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Deputy Minister, Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development
We will do that for you.
10:05 a.m.
Conservative
David Yurdiga Conservative Fort McMurray—Cold Lake, AB
Thank you, Madam Chair.
The reality is that the carbon tax will drive up the costs in remote northern communities. The fuel that is needed to heat their homes, create electricity, and ship in food will add to the costs of items northerners are already struggling to afford. In some instances, costs are already rising as goods are being shipped out of provinces that already have a carbon tax. Has your department calculated how the increased costs of shipping and electricity will affect program delivery?