Indigenous and Northern Affairs Committee on Dec. 8th, 2022

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Yes, the Inuit-Crown Partnership Committee is addressing all kinds of problems and difficulties, including food insecurity.

[Marilène Gill, Bloc, Manicouagan, QC]

But it isn't for everyone.

In other words, it isn't complete because it doesn't include everyone.

Thank you, Minister.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

Thank you, Mrs. Gill.

We will continue with you, Ms. Idlout. You have two and a half minutes.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

[Member spoke in Inuktitut as follows:]

ᖁᔭᓐᓇᒦᒃ, ᑕᐃᒃᑯᐊ ᐅᖃᐅᓯᕆᒋᐊᖅᑲᐅᔭᑎᑦ ᐃᓄᓐᓄᑦ ᑐᕌᖓᒋᐊᖅᑐᕕᓃᑦ, ᐋ, ᐃᖃᓗᓐᓃᑎᒡᓗᖓ ᑐᓴᖅᑎᑕᐅᓚᐅᖅᑐᖓ ᑕᐃᑲᓂ ᑲᑎᒪᕕᔾᔪᐊᓚᐅᕐᒪᑕ ᐅᓂᒃᑳ-ᓚᐅᖅᓱᑎᒃ ᐃᒡᓗᓕᕆᓂᐊᑉ ᒥᒃᓵᓄᑦ, ᑕᐃᑲᓂ, ᐋ, ᐅᖃᐅᔾᔭᐅᓚᐅᖅᑐᒍᑦ ᑖᒃᑯᐊᒎᖅ ᐃᓄᓐᓄᑦ ᑐᕌᖓᔪᐃᑦ ᐊᕕᑦᑐᖅᑕᐅᒋᐊᖃᓚᐅᕐᒪᑕ ᑲᓇᑕᓕᒫᕐᒥᒃ ᐅᔾᔨᕈᓱᒃᑎᒃᐹᓪᓕ-ᕈᒪᕙᒋᑦ ᑕᐃᒃᑯᐊᒎᖅ ᐃᓄᓐᓄᑦ ᑐᕌᖓᔪᑦ ᓄᓇᕗᒻᒧᑦ ᑐᕌᖓᔪᖅᑕᖃᓚᐅᓐᖏᑦ-ᑎᐊᖅᑐᖅ, 2016-ᒥᒡᓗ 2018-ᒥᒡᓗ ᑖᓐᓇ ᑐᑭᓯᒃᑲᓐᑎᑦᑎᔪᒪᑐᐃᓐᓇᖅᑕᒋᑦ ᖃᓄᐃᒻᒪᑦ ᑐᓂᓯᒃᑲᓐᓂᕆᐊᖃᕐᒪᖔᑦᑕ ᓄᓇᕗᒻᒥᐅᑦ ᑭᓯᐊᓂ ᐊᓯᖏᓐᓂᒃ ᐱᕕᑭᑦᑑᓗᐊᕋᒪ ᐊᓯᖏᓐᓂᒃ ᐊᐱᖅᑯᑎᖃᕈᒪᒻᒥᒐᒪ, ᓲᖃᐃᒻᒪᑦ ᓄᓇᕗᒻᒥᐅᑦ ᒪᑯᓂᖓ ᐃᓱᒫᓘᑎᖃᕐᒪᑕ, ᐃᖕᓇᐃᑦ ᐊᐅᓪᓚᖅᑎᑕᐅᔪᒪᓐᖏᑦᑐᑦ ᓄᓇᒥᓐᓂᒃ, ᐃᓐᓇ, ᐃᓐᓇᕈᐃᓐᓇᕈᒪᔪᐃᑦ ᐊᐅᓪᓚᖅᑎᑕᐅᖏᓐᓇᖅᐸᒻᒪᑕ, ᐋ, ᑕᓐᓇ, ᐋ, 2021ᖑᑎᒡᓗᒍ 1ᐱᓕᔭᓐᒥᒡᒎᖅ one billion ᑐᓂᓯᓛᕋᑦᓯ ᑖᒃᑯᐊ, ᐋ, ᐃᓐᓇᑐᖃᒡᕕᓕᕆᔾᔪᑎ-ᓄᓪᓘᓐᓃᑦ ᑖᒃᑯᐊ ᐅᓂᒃᑲᐅᑎᒋᐊᒃᑲᓐᓂᕈᓐᓇᖅᐱᑎᒎᖅ, ᐋ, ᖃᓄᖅ ᐱᓕᕆᐊᒋᕙᓐ-ᓂᐊᕐᒪᖔᑦᓯ ᓄᑖᓂᒃ ᑖᒃᑯᐊ ᐃᓐᓇᑐᖃᐃᑦ, ᐋ, ᐃᓄᐃᑦ ᐱᓗᐊᖅᓱᒋᑦ ᓄᓇᒥᖕᓂᒃ ᐃᓐᓇᕈᐃᓐᓇᖅᓯᒪᖁᓪᓗᒋᑦ.

[Inuktitut text interpreted as follows:]

Thank you.

You reported about Inuit housing. When I was in Iqaluit, I was informed that there was a meeting on housing. I was told at that meeting and conference that the houses slated for Inuit had to be divided for all of Canada. Out of those that had been designated for Inuit in 2016 and 2018, they did not have anything slated for the territory of Nunavut. I wish to remind you to remember Nunavut.

I don't have enough time. I have many other concerns.

In Nunavut, we have many concerns about elders, who do not want to leave their homeland. They want to live in their own homeland, but they are sent from their homeland for elder care.

You've said that you committed some money towards elder facilities in Nunavut. Can you elaborate on the Nunavut infrastructure that you have committed and that you are slating for Inuit elders in Nunavut? Please elaborate.

[English]

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Just as a quick note on housing, budget 2022 is investing $845 million to support housing in Inuit Nunangat. We work closely with Inuit rights holders and with the Government of Nunavut to roll out that money, but the final decision on where it's invested is with the rights holders. That's important. That has never been done before in our relationship.

On senior support housing.... Was that it?

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

It was long-term care.

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

Long-term care is a very important issue that comes up regularly with the Government of Nunavut. We are working in good faith with them to try to deliver better services in long-term care and in health care generally. I know that has been a priority, and our governments are working together.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

[Member spoke in Inuktitut as follows:]

ᐋᒻ, ᓂᐅᑐᐃᓯᓐ ᓄᐊᕐᑦ nutrition north ᒥᒃᓵᓄ ᐊᐱᕆᓪᓛᓗᒍᒪᓪᓗᖓ ᑖᓐᓇ ᐊᐱᖅᑯᑎᒋᖃᑦᑕᖅᓯᒪᒻᒥᒐᒃᑯ ᖃᓄᖅ ᖃᐅᔨᓴᓲᖑᒻᒪᖔᑦᓯᐅᒃ ᑖᒃᑯᐊ ᓲᕐᓗ ᓄᐊᑐᕐᓐ ᓯᑐᐊᕐᔅᑯᑦ ᓄᐊᕐᑦᒫᕐᑯᑦ northern stores, north mart ᒥᓕᔭᓐᔅᑲᓪᓛᓗᓐᓂᒃ millions ᑖᒃᑯᐊ ᓂᐅᕕᕐᕖᑦ ᓇᒻᒥᓂᖅ ᑮᓇᐅᔾᔭᑦᓴᖅᐸᓪᓕᐊᔪᐊᓘᓪᓗᑎᒃ ᓲᓪᓗ, ᐋ, ᐃᑲᔪᖅᑐᖓᖅᑕᓯ ᑖᒃᑯᐊ ᓂᐅᕕᕐᕕᕐᔪᐊᕌᓗᐃᑦ , ᖃᓄᖅ ᖃᐅᔨᓴᖃᑦᑕᖅᐱᓯᐅᒃ ᑖᒃᑯᐊ ᐃᓄᖕᓄᑦ ᑐᕌᖓᒋᐊᖃᖅᑑᒐᓗᐊᑦ ᑎᑭᑉᐸᓪᓕᐊᒐᓗᐊᕐᒪᖔᑦᑕ ᐃᓄᖁᑎᒥᓐᓄᑦ.

[Inuktitut text interpreted as follows:]

Regarding nutrition north, I have a quick question, and I've asked it many times. How do you evaluate the effectiveness of nutrition north?

The retail outlets are given millions in refunds. It's the retail outlets that are getting the refunds, and very little is going to the consumer. How do you evaluate how it will affect the consumer rather than the retail outlets?

[English]

[Dan Vandal, Liberal, Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB]

It's very important to us that the food subsidized by nutrition north is more affordable because of the subsidies it receives. We have a nutrition north advisory committee that advises us on policies, and there have been audits done over the past few years on the programs as they have been implemented. Those audits are shared with territorial leaders and with Inuit rights holders.

We think there is room for improvement. That's why we are always consulting and have an open mind when it comes to making improvements that make sense. When they are proven by data and research, they will improve the program.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

Thank you, Ms. Idlout.

With that, the first panel comes to a close.

I would like to thank Minister Vandal and his team for appearing before our committee today to answer questions about supplementary estimates (B). We very much appreciate it.

With that, we will briefly suspend to prepare for the second panel.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

We're now resuming with our second panel.

I welcome Minister Miller and his team, who are appearing before us in the context of supplementary estimates (B).

The usual process is that we provide five minutes for introductory remarks, followed by questions.

I'll remind all committee members that we're expecting bells at 5:30. We would normally adjourn at that point, unless there is a unanimous request for extension beyond that point.

That said, I now invite Minister Miller to make his introductory remarks for the next five minutes.

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Minister of Crown-Indigenous Relations]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Kwe kwe. Ulaakut. Tansi. Hello. Bonjour.

I want to acknowledge that we are meeting on the unceded territory of the Algonquin Anishinabe people.

Today, I will give an overview of investments my government is making to ensure that Canada is honoring its lawful obligations to Indigenous Peoples and working to renew Canada’s relationship with treaty partners and all Indigenous communities.

We also continue to work with other government departments to implement investments and policies that address the root causes of missing and murdered Indigenous women, girls and 2SLGBTQQIA+ people.

We will soon begin the engagement process with First Nations partners on redesigning the Additions-to-Reserve policy to ensure it’s effective and inclusive. We are also working with First Nations to modernize the First Nations Fiscal Management Act, and are working closely with First Nations fiscal institutions and First Nations to ensure they have sufficient resources to further their visions for self-determination.

Crown-Indigenous Relations supplementary estimates (B) include initiatives totalling $6.3 billion, which will bring the total budgetary funding for the department to approximately $13.7 billion.

Roughly half of the estimates, $2.9 billion, is funding for out-of-court settlements. These funds are used to advance reconciliation by paving the way for more respectful and constructive relationships with indigenous peoples.

These estimates also include $673 million in new funding for the continued management of the indigenous childhood claims litigation, further supporting the compensation of survivors of physical and sexual abuse under the day school settlement agreement, as well as related administration costs for the day schools and sixties scoop settlement agreements. As of November 2 of this year, over 118,000 class action members have received compensation for the harms they suffered attending a day school, and 20,798 class action members have been deemed eligible for compensation for the harms they suffered related to the sixties scoop.

Additionally, the top-up of $678 million in new funding in this fiscal year for the specific claims settlement fund ensures that funds are available for the timely payment of settlement agreements reached through the negotiations with first nations, or any compensation awards that are made by the Specific Claims Tribunal.

In parallel to our ongoing efforts to work with First Nations to resolve their claims expeditiously, we are working with the Assembly of First Nations and other Indigenous partners on the joint development of reforms to improve the specific claims process.

In addition to reform efforts, we are striving to address the lack of housing for Indigenous communities, which has been a long-standing crisis. Our partners have informed us of their urgent need for safe and sustainable housing options for their communities.

New funding of $458 million was provided through budget 2022 to improve and expand indigenous housing and infrastructure for self-governing and modern treaty first nations, Inuit and Métis. This funding extends and enhances the distinctions-based housing strategy work that's already under way, such as the Métis nation and Inuit Nunangat housing strategies. This investment helps to address the critical housing needs of indigenous partners and supports better health and socio-economic outcomes overall.

Mr. Chair, the funding included in the Supplementary Estimates (B) will further support the department as we work to deliver on our mandate and priorities.

I appreciate the opportunity to discuss these estimates with the committee. I'm happy to now proceed to questions.

Meegwetch. Qujannamiik. Marsi. Thank you. Merci.

[The Chair, Liberal, Marc Garneau]

Thank you, Minister.

We will now go to questions, starting with the Conservatives.

I give the floor to Mr. Schmale or Mr. Zimmer for six minutes.

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes—Brock, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Minister, for appearing. It's always a pleasure to have you here.

Minister, a few hours ago, the AFN came out against Bill C-21. Will you be supporting the AFN's call for amendments to be made?

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC]

First and foremost, I think we can acknowledge that it is entirely within their discretion to come out with that type of resolution. Clearly we've heard from partners. I have heard from partners about concerns with respect to Bill C-21 as recently as today and yesterday, particularly in side conversations I had at the AFN. That's work we will do with indigenous partners. The Prime Minister and Minister Mendicino have also signalled that, and they look forward to that engagement.

We know that long rifles in particular are used to sustain hunting practices and for food initiatives and sustainability. That's work we'll be doing.

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes—Brock, ON]

Will you be advocating for the AFN's position at the cabinet table?

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC]

What I say around the cabinet table remains private, as you know, MP Schmale. I do voice concerns freely and openly, as my duty to indigenous peoples demands.

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes—Brock, ON]

Just on a different topic, the estimates show that almost 93% of executive-level employees in your department received a performance bonus in the 2021-22 fiscal year. According to an Order Paper question, the criteria included individual results for executives rather than having bonuses based on how well the department performs.

According to the criteria, it seems they're based on the individual's results. I'm not sure how many organizations work that way. Should they not be based on the department's success rather than on an individual's success?

[Marc Miller, Liberal, Ville-Marie—Le Sud-Ouest—Île-des-Soeurs, QC]

I'll pass the substance of the question over to my deputy minister.

This is an independent public service. I will, however, defend to the bone the work my department has done, as well as the work Indigenous Services Canada has done, to keep indigenous people safe throughout COVID.

I'll let the substance of the question be answered by my deputy minister.

[Daniel Quan-Watson, Deputy Minister, Department of Crown-Indigenous Relations and Northern Affairs]

There are two parts to the performance agreements, one of which follows from requirements from the clerk to the entire deputy minister community. The requirements then flow down into performance agreements for employees in individual departments. Then, yes, each director or each executive has a set of criteria that they are measured by and that they are required to meet. I'm responsible for all of those.

It's not accurate to say that 93% got a bonus. They got performance pay, but the biggest chunk of that every single year is to people who are deemed to have met the requirements that were set out for them. They get the amount that is for meeting their requirements, not necessarily for having exceeded—

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes—Brock, ON]

However, these are personal requirements, not departmental requirements. Is that correct?

[Daniel Quan-Watson]

Well, they're departmental in the sense that as a deputy minister, I decide ultimately what those are and whether or not they have met them in the furtherance of the objectives of the department.

[Jamie Schmale, Conservative, Haliburton—Kawartha Lakes—Brock, ON]

It says here in this Order Paper question that “Individual performance pay holds executives accountable for individual results and is not related to Departmental Results, which measure organizational goals.”

[Daniel Quan-Watson]

I hold them to account for the portion that they're required to do, and they have done that. However, as the deputy head, I am responsible for the performance of the department as a whole. Each of them is responsible for their portion, as I assign it to them, for the course of the year and the performance over that period of time.