Evidence of meeting #132 for Industry, Science and Technology in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was arr.
A video is available from Parliament.
President, Regroupement des artistes en arts visuels du Québec
Lastly, I just want to add that our association is also working to ensure that artists become professionals in this area. We're currently working very hard because we hope that this legislation will be implemented. We're preparing our members to become professionals, to keep proper track of their works and to know where their works end up. Our members are also preparing to receive this. It's not 1400 or 1900. It's 2018. People are becoming professionals, and we hope that this will be helpful with regard to the expected legislation.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Dan Ruimy
I started a whole thing here.
Mr. Badawey is next, very quickly, and then Mr. London.
Vance Badawey Niagara Centre, Lib.
I'm sort of new at this. This is my first time on this committee discussing this, and I'm listening to this. Having been in the business world for the better part of my life, before I entered this part of my life, I'm listening to it with great interest. I know that in industry you have processes, and you have systems. You have market access, market-valued market shares, traceability, and all that as part of the system.
Has there been no move afoot or any effort by people like you who are in the business to actually put that in place, to put a template or a blueprint in place that looks after the whole process from A to Z, from the time of production to tracing it and valuing it, and then, of course, to sale and beyond that, tracking it so that royalties can be looked after in a consistent and fair market-value manner?
Executive Director, Canadian Artists' Representation
Part of the problem is that when the work is sold in the primary market, the artist isn't told whom it goes to, for the most part. They don't tell you that.
Niagara Centre, Lib.
That would automatically kick in every time the code on that piece is entered.
That would be the law. When that piece is sold, the bar code would be punched in. If it's not, you're breaking the law. That's the traceability part of it. The process follows the piece right from A to Z, and therefore the market value kicks in, with regard to who made it, where it's from, what geography they're from, what demographic they're from. It just follows it. It happens naturally. No one really has to keep an eye on it but the system itself.
Executive Director, Regroupement des artistes en arts visuels du Québec
Again, I think we're talking about tools, that the law needs to be technologically neutral. We're talking about ways to apply the right, which would be traceability, blockchain, arts banks. There are tools. There's the copyright filing that you can do. The tools exist, and they need to be refined in this new technology.
First and foremost, you need the right. Then you'll find the tools to apply those rights. The idea is to stake the right so you can follow the life of your artwork. It's not a question of lottery; the fame and recognition come with time and work and exposure. The fact is, you have to create the right, and then the tools will follow. It's technology. The copyright law needs to be technologically neutral. That's a fundamental concept of law.
President, Regroupement des artistes en arts visuels du Québec
I've exhibited in a gallery. Serious galleries keep track of their artists and register their artists' works because the galleries are interested in knowing how much the artists will cost them. The galleries keep close track of their artists.
Our association provides training to members to help them become professionals. As Mr. Guérin said, once the legislation has been implemented, we'll have everything we need to frame all this. However, first we need legislation in order to frame the rest afterward.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Dan Ruimy
While this is great, we do have other business.
I promised you, Mr. London. You have 30 seconds.
Director, Art Dealers Association of Canada
In another life, we used to deal in contemporary art from southern artists. Every time we made a sale, along with the cheque we said, “We sold this painting to Mr. and Mrs. Smith.” We said exactly whom we sold it to. But I would think there are probably also some very serious privacy concerns that are tied up in disclosure like that.
I was going to say that I might not have spent as much time in restaurants and bars in Iqaluit, but any of the things that I saw selling for $100 were not worth more than $200 or $300, not the $5,000 or whatever. There was a brilliant point I was going to make, but I've since forgotten it.
All this is to say that I'm skeptical.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Dan Ruimy
Thank you very much for a very lively discussion. It was very interesting.
We're going to break for a very quick minute and then we have a motion to debate. If we can stick around closely, we'll suspend for just a minute.
Thank you to our guests for coming in today.
Conservative
Dane Lloyd Conservative Sturgeon River—Parkland, AB
Thank you.
I want to make this brief. I did put in this motion a number of weeks ago, but out of respect for our witnesses and this committee study, I wanted to delay it until a convenient time for the committee.
As many of you know, Ottawa was hit by six tornadoes a number of weeks ago. It's been extensively covered in the news.
Many of my constituents actually brought up this issue to me on Canada Day. After this copyright study is completed, I think it would be very prudent for the Standing Committee on Industry, Science and Technology to allocate no fewer than two meetings to explore the causes of the breakdown in the process related to cellular coverage and telecommunications during natural disasters such as the Ottawa disaster, and what recommendations we can make as a committee to improve the system and to improve the public safety of Canadians.
I'd submit that to the committee for consideration.
Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola, CPC
There is no timetable on this, so I am sure the chair would be able to fit this in, working with the clerk.
There is a significant public interest here. Since the original story ran in the media, I have also had media in my own local area ask about this.
This is a big country. We have a variety of different types of ownership, telecommunications, towers, etc. Canadians are going to want to know, when they give their children or other loved ones a cellphone, what reasonable expectations they should have that it will work, and under what conditions.
That's something people here in Ottawa recently discovered, and there's public interest in our just doing a short study on this to see if we should be concerned about what the capacity of the system is, and what the different parts of the system are. Different parts of this country will operate under very different conditions, so maybe we should just have a good discussion around it.
I encourage members from all sides to support this. It would be a good thing for us to do.
NDP
Brian Masse NDP Windsor West, ON
I would propose a friendly amendment. We will determine later whether it is friendly or not. After “technology”, I would add “or a subcommittee”.
I would leave that open before I speak to the main motion to find out whether the amendment would be acceptable, because I believe under procedure we need to speak to the amendment before the main motion. I don't know if that is—
NDP
Conservative
NDP
Brian Masse NDP Windsor West, ON
Well, if it's going to be used as a condition of time for this committee, then a subcommittee could easily be struck to accommodate the committee's time frame. It's something I would be willing to participate in. An extra day or two is all that's required. That's something I'm open to, because it's an important issue. It's a reasonable request.
Committee business would provide for that, I think, under the main motion. If that is seen as an obstacle in terms of time frames, then all we're asking here is simply that something be done before the end of the calendar year. It's quite reasonable. I would make that a friendly amendment, and perhaps that would get the main motion passed.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Dan Ruimy
Is there any more debate on the amendment? No.
We have to call the vote first on the amendment.