Industry Committee on Aug. 14th, 2020

[Philip Landon]

I haven't heard that, in terms of universities changing.

I think the market is usually that with the admissions requirements, the top students are able to get in, and if there's less competition, more students will be able to get in, but, really, I haven't heard of that being an issue or a strategy across the country.

[Tracy Gray, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

We did hear today that there were increased costs, in large part due to technology. Of course, that's with everyone. It doesn't matter whether you're in business or in this type of work; everyone has had to increase their costs with technology, sanitation and all kinds of different issues with COVID-19.

Have you had conversations, or are you hearing about a reduction in costs on the campuses related to not having as many students or faculty there on a daily basis?

[Philip Landon]

There certainly have been reductions in costs across the community. There have been layoffs as a result, so it's been a tough time at many of our campuses.

[Tracy Gray, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

We did hear a lot today about research dollars and some of the good work that's been done. Have you heard if some of the research funding that's been coming in...? Is it fairly consistent? Has it been increasing? Has it been decreasing during this time? Are you getting any sense of that, looking forward?

[Philip Landon]

Again, there may be others who are better placed to speak than I am, but the Canadian government has added to the research fund in terms of looking for COVID-19 strategies. That's been very helpful. In many cases, timelines have been extended, and that's been very helpful as well.

[Tracy Gray, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

I have a last quick question.

When it comes to students in the fields that we've seen are important during this time, especially those in nursing, the sciences and supply chain management, have you heard of some universities changing their models to address some of these sectors that have really risen during this time and where there's a greater need?

[Philip Landon]

Yes, I think so. The other witnesses have given examples of how universities have pivoted quite well to address the needs of the community, and the links between the communities and the universities have never been stronger as a result of that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sherry Romanado]

Thank you very much.

We now go to MP Jowhari. You have the floor for five minutes.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you to all our witnesses.

I'm going to question each one of the witnesses on a different aspect of international students. I do understand there's been accommodation made for the new applicants to be able to participate online. However, I'm getting a lot of feedback and our office is getting a lot of feedback from the existing international students who reside in Canada and who are engaged in master's, doctoral and post-doctoral studies, and some of them in their first four years.

What we are hearing is that they are having problems sourcing finances from their homeland. Therefore, they are having a lot of issues being able to find accommodations to live and being able to pay for their books, food and also their education. What is happening is that now they're under a lot of stress to be able to, first and foremost, pay for their education, and they put that first. They're making compromises in other aspects of their lives, such as having four, five or six people now living in a single room, sharing some books or just not being able to do their studies.

My question for each of the witnesses is this: How can the universities help these international students, and how can the federal government partner with universities to help these international students get through this?

I've also collected some information, some suggestions from them, which I will gladly share.

If I may, I'll start with Mr. Landon from Universities Canada. Can you share your thoughts with us on how we can manage this challenge?

[Philip Landon]

Thanks very much.

The hope had been that, when the Canada emergency student bursary became available, it would be made available to international students. It wasn't, so they have fallen between the cracks in terms of emergency support during the pandemic.

Universities have funds and means of supporting students in need, but those are being severely tested right now. As you speak with the presidents and rectors of the universities, they can talk about how each campus is trying to deal with this issue.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Let's go to Dr. McCauley.

How can your university help, and how can the federal government help?

[Dr. Ed McCauley]

We have around 2,500 continuing international students, many of whom decided to stay to continue their studies during COVID-19 because they wanted to advance.

I haven't heard about any specific cases coming to our office about hardship around international students in particular, but as Philip Landon mentioned, we have many different approaches at the University of Calgary to deal with students in need, including mental health supports, economic supports and so on.

I think one of the pieces that are important for the federal government is that through research funding and the continuity of research funding, many students—international students, in particular graduate students—are supported through grants and scholarships. That support is really beneficial for their ongoing subsistence and to supplement what they get through the universities in teaching and so on.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Let's go quickly to the Université du Québec. There were some recommendations made that I'd like to share and put on the record.

Monsieur Martel.

[Denis Martel]

Naturally, for a small regional institution like ours, 500 international students is quite a sizable population. The university has put measures in place to support them. We rely heavily on the regional community, which does a good job of meeting the demand for help thanks to the university foundation. The federal government could lend a hand by transferring funding to community organizations in the region, which are there to support the students. That might be a good solution.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Thank you.

I have about 10 seconds to go.

Can the universities kindly consider using some of their excess capacity as it relates to their residences, which are empty right now, to help these students, as well as consider providing an extension to the international students over one or two terms as it relates to their tuition, with the commitment that they will pay? Their families are also suffering as a result of COVID-19.

I thank you, Madam Chair, for your consideration.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sherry Romanado]

Thank you very much.

Unfortunately, that is your time.

We will now go to MP Simard.

Mr. Simard, you may go ahead. You have two and a half minutes.

[Mario Simard, Bloc, Jonquière, QC]

My question is for Ms. Fusaro.

If I'm not mistaken, Ms. Fusaro, in your presentation, you spoke of three measures or recommendations that could be implemented to better support the Université du Québec system with a view to recovering from the crisis. Could you tell us more about that?

[Magda Fusaro]

Thank you for your question.

The first recommendation in our brief ultimately calls for investment in research dissemination, coordination and, above all, partnership. Not many of you asked, and that's normal, but research is built on partnerships with communities and, to a large extent, with companies. You'd be surprised at how much universities collaborate with companies. It's a research ecosystem. Researchers don't work in a single university, so support for interuniversity, intercommunity initiatives that bring partners together is hugely important.

The second recommendation has to do with the programs. As I mentioned, the federal government funds research, and the fact that research is concentrated in a select few universities—exclusively those with faculties of medicine—is detrimental to all of Canada. My colleague Mr. Martel made the point with respect to the regions, and I can do the same for Montreal, which is also a region. It's necessary to diversify research, which is really what the Naylor report showed. The more you diversify research, the more the population as a whole benefits. It doesn't seem like much because it doesn't require millions of dollars more in investment. What it does require is a better allocation of the money between innovative programs and emerging research teams. It's always the same teams that get the funding, hence the concentration. That's what we want to illustrate. Diversifying research and giving everyone funding is mutually beneficial.

Someone asked a question earlier about partnerships with local communities. We are deeply rooted in communities. The universities are working on real problems. As far as basic research goes, they're also contributing to the community, and they pursue innovation together.

The third, and final, recommendation concerns digital technology. You talked about that. There are still areas all over Canada where it's difficult to access resources, whatever they may be. Access is a problem, plain and simple. That underscores the need to develop digital technology. That would be useful. Distance education has come up a lot, but some students are on campus, while respecting all the proper safety and public health guidelines, of course. That said, students can be on site and still need digital technology.

I hope that answers your question.

[Mario Simard, Bloc, Jonquière, QC]

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sherry Romanado]

Thank you.

Our next round of questions is for Mr. Masse.

You have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I want to continue, if I could, with Mr. Landon, to get an overall sense of where universities are with regard to critical needs for infrastructure and a green economy. The other thing, too, is housing. Is there an inventory list? With perhaps not as many students returning....

My daughter is actually at NSCAD, and she's staying there because she doesn't want to fly back and so on, a series of other decisions, just to be safer there. I know that some of her classmates are staying. Some will be coming back, but they will be fewer.

Is there any opportunity here? For example, maybe older residences and other living accommodations that may not have a high standard could be enhanced—greenhouse gas emissions reductions or safer living quarters designed for future challenges like this one. Obviously, we could have this extended further, or we could have a similar scenario evolve that we don't expect.

Is there an opportunity here, with a reduced population, to perhaps seize that and do some bold, innovative improvements for our universities, on campus or just around campus with facilities?

[Philip Landon]

Yes, there absolutely is. I think I referenced in my opening remarks that our universities have $7 billion in shovel-ready projects. The last time there was an infrastructure fund, a few years ago, we were able to build the infrastructure—green infrastructure—in three years, in a timely manner and in a manner that helped upgrade our universities.

It would be helpful now as we go digital and as we think about older buildings that have suffered from deferred maintenance. Now would be a very good time to invest in these for energy efficiency, for refurbishing and for green infrastructure.

Our universities are very much ready and need this funding to be able to move further into the 21st century.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Thank you.

I know, Madam Chair.

I just got yellow-carded and I don't want to get red-carded, so thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sherry Romanado]

I'm sorry about that. I hate doing that.

We will now go to our third round of questions.

Our first round goes to MP Patzer. You have the floor for five minutes.

[Jeremy Patzer, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Before I begin, I'm just going to move my motion from last meeting:

That, as part of its study on the Canadian Response to the COVID-19 Pandemic, the Standing Committee on Industry, Science and Technology invite Daniel Therrien, Privacy Commissioner of Canada, to testify regarding the development and ongoing operation of the recently released contact tracing application.