Evidence of meeting #21 for Industry, Science and Technology in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was industry.
A recording is available from Parliament.
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Bernard Généreux Conservative Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC
In regard to the infrastructure, we're talking a lot with other mandates on the committee about the Internet and everything related to satellite and low-earth orbit.
How advanced are you in the world in regard to those technologies?
12:35 p.m.
Chief Executive Officer, MDA
We are very advanced in the world in those technologies. MDA has been on four different low-earth orbit communications constellations so far and is talking to many other companies around the world to leverage our technology and advanced manufacturing capability for high-volume, low-earth orbit satellite manufacturing capability. That engages a large supply chain in Quebec and across Canada for us to do that. We're very well positioned in that market.
12:40 p.m.
Conservative
Bernard Généreux Conservative Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC
Thank you.
Mr. Chartrand, I was wondering whether you were anglophone or francophone. You speak both languages so well I'm not sure which one's your mother tongue.
Incidentally, I congratulate you on your knowledge of the industry and its workers. Some major changes have occurred with Bombardier and others. Many people in the general population have criticized the government for subsidizing Bombardier, and others, for the CSeries, which became Airbus.
How do you view the public's perception of the government's contribution to the very long-term strategies for the aeronautics industry?
12:40 p.m.
Quebec Coordinator, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers
I think a very long-term strategy would help avoid the situations we've experienced in the past, as in the case of Bombardier.
Having a long-term strategy that supports the industry in a structured way would help avoid systematically throwing away money that's not earmarked for anything in particular every time a crisis occurs simply because the house is on fire and absolutely has to be put out immediately.
The French have a very positive view of Airbus. It's one of the businesses that are highly regarded because industry financing has become a culture for them. They stand behind their industry because they know it employs thousands of people and they support it on a regular basis.
We, on the other hand, unfortunately tend to believe that we have to throw money at it unconditionally because we're in the middle of a crisis.
12:40 p.m.
Conservative
Bernard Généreux Conservative Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC
We don't have a long-term strategy; that's what I'm hearing.
12:40 p.m.
Quebec Coordinator, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers
Exactly. It's a monumental error that creates a negative public perception.
That perception will continue to be negative as long as we operate this way, even though the industry provides work for 200,000 employees.
12:40 p.m.
Conservative
Bernard Généreux Conservative Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC
That's impressive.
Ms. Benoît, can you briefly name some countries whose strategy is to fund wage subsidies over several years as a result of the pandemic?
Can you tell us whether any countries are doing that?
12:40 p.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Aéro Montréal
I know that France has measures, but I wouldn't be able to discuss wage strategies or wage subsidies as such.
What I pay more attention to are the innovation measures and the way governments support clean technologies.
12:40 p.m.
Conservative
Bernard Généreux Conservative Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC
As Mr. Chartrand just said, we tend to invest a lot of money, and that's what the government has done over the past year to support industries in general. What you're asking is that we continue to provide that support in the same way. I'm sincerely somewhat surprised at your idea of covering wages for three or four years.
Please explain that proposal to me.
12:40 p.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Aéro Montréal
We simply need to consider the fact that it will take the aerospace manufacturing industry two more years to emerge from the crisis. It's either the wage subsidy or other types of assistance. We have to consider this. That support helps.
12:40 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sherry Romanado
Thank you very much.
Our next round of questions goes to MP Jaczek.
You have the floor for five minutes.
March 9th, 2021 / 12:40 p.m.
Liberal
Helena Jaczek Liberal Markham—Stouffville, ON
Thank you very much, Madam Chair.
First of all, I'd like to thank all the witnesses for their testimony. Obviously, we hear your frustration and your anxiety about your industry. I'm on the transport committee as well, so we have been studying the whole aspect of the impacts of COVID-19 on your industry. You've alluded to the fact that you had some issues even prior to the pandemic.
Monsieur Chartrand, when you came to the transport committee back in January—your association did—there was a question about how the Canada emergency wage subsidy had been used to maintain employment. I believe there was some question as to whether all employers were taking full advantage of that program. Could you elaborate?
12:40 p.m.
Quebec Coordinator, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers
They are not. I have to be honest. A lot of the small and medium-sized businesses are using it. Some of the major ones, like Air Canada, are not, or they're partially using it. There haven't been obligations put on the employers to use it to keep people employed and at work. I believe that was what the CEWS was for, initially. It was to make sure that we kept people employed and at work.
Why? Knowing that it will take a long time to recover in that industry, as Madame Benoît has said, many of these employers, such as Air Canada, have decided that since there were people who were going to be on furlough for a year to two years, they simply didn't want to pay the difference. They were getting a wage subsidy for 75%. They didn't want to pay the additional 25% or the benefits, which are attached to collective bargaining agreements.
It is extremely important that we continue the program and not lose our talent and that we make sure people stay and work in the small and medium-sized enterprises, and maybe that there is a merging of two different programs, but the wage subsidy is important, and it has helped. I can't say that it hasn't. I think it should be maintained, but there needs to be more sector-specific aid to the employers to make sure they can support their people at work and have new projects for people to work on, like Suzanne was saying for green energy. If we don't support the employers, we're going to lose that talent, and then employers won't be interested in investing here in Canada.
12:45 p.m.
Liberal
Helena Jaczek Liberal Markham—Stouffville, ON
Certainly, during the transport committee, we've learned that the federal government has supported the industry writ large to the tune of some $2 billion when it comes to CEWS and when it comes to support for airports, regional routes and so on.
You've talked about a national labour strategy and even potentially the opportunity for repatriation of skilled employees and so on. Have you costed out what such a labour strategy would look like? You've talked about apprenticeships, etc. Have you any dollar figures that you've come up with?
12:45 p.m.
Quebec Coordinator, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers
No. I don't have that information. I didn't cost it out. I'm sorry about that.
12:45 p.m.
Liberal
Helena Jaczek Liberal Markham—Stouffville, ON
Would anyone in your association have done such an analysis? It could be very useful for us.
12:45 p.m.
Quebec Coordinator, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers
I will look into that and I'll get back to you.
12:45 p.m.
Liberal
12:45 p.m.
Quebec Coordinator, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers
Absolutely.
12:45 p.m.
Liberal
Helena Jaczek Liberal Markham—Stouffville, ON
Madame Benoît, you've made it clear that the supercluster strategy of our government has somehow not benefited the aerospace industry. Could you elaborate on what you would see as improvements to that strategy?
12:45 p.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Aéro Montréal
The strategy provides real value for more basic research. We're talking about tiers 1, 2 and 3. We invest enormous amounts in research, but we aren't applying that research in certain sectors.
Given our aerospace experience, we did propose that the government establish an innovation supercluster to go hand in hand with technological development more akin to commercialization. That would have helped to create jobs and to mobilize the research centres and students doing internships as part of those projects. The entire ecosystem would thus have been mobilized.
In fact, the government representatives simply told us that the aerospace sector was so well organized it had all the necessary elements in its ecosystem and didn't need a supercluster. That's the answer we were given, and we've lost ground since then.
12:45 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Sherry Romanado
Thank you very much.
Mr. Lemire, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.
12:45 p.m.
Bloc
Sébastien Lemire Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
Thank you, Madam Chair.
My question is for Mr. Chartrand from the IAMAW.
Today, we've talked a lot about how important it is to send a strong signal that the government should acknowledge the industry, its international competitiveness and the need for it to feel supported.
Tell me about the types of jobs that are available in aeronautics right now, particularly in the manufacturing and maintenance sectors, and about the need for training, mentoring and knowledge transfer.
12:45 p.m.
Quebec Coordinator, International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers
As Ms. Benoît said, we're currently able to build an aircraft from A to Z, both here and elsewhere in Canada. So we have mechanics who maintain the aircraft and build engines, assembly line workers who assemble the aircraft and people who work on the avionic suites you see inside the aircraft. We also have engineers in the offices.
So jobs in the aeronautics field are highly varied. These are middle-class people, and they represent a lot of taxes that are paid to the government to fund our social programs and so on.
Our challenge is the labour shortage. There weren't enough people in school before the pandemic. Most training has now stopped, and plant employees are being laid off. As I explained earlier, many people with more seniority are retiring. Consequently, there's a lack of knowledge transfer within businesses.
The academic training of a licensed mechanic may take up to four years. Consequently, there'll be a void if our training programs and talent aren't supported since many people will be retiring and there won't be enough people to do the work. Some major customers and other businesses won't want to invest here any more if we can't demonstrate that the industry is being supported, that we will continue to train people and that we will meet future demand from employers.