Industry Committee on Sept. 16th, 2024

[Annette Verschuren]

When I got on the board of SDTC, I clearly disclosed to the minister, to the ISED people and to management that I had a declaration that happened 18 months prior to my getting on that board. That is the only real conflict I've had over the whole term of my chairmanship.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

Ms. Verschuren, I have some questions particularly about NRStor, of which you are the founder and still owner and the chair of the board, I believe. You've been involved in projects in particular with NRStor, Hydrostor and Oneida. I believe last year that project received $50 million from Natural Resources Canada. Is that correct?

[Annette Verschuren]

That's correct.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

That project received $170 million from the Canada Infrastructure Bank. Is that correct?

[Annette Verschuren]

That is correct.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

Andrée-Lise Méthot, the director who served on the board with you at Cycle Capital and served on the board with you at the green slush fund, was moved over and appointed by the Liberals to the Infrastructure Bank when that money was finally approved. Is that correct?

[Annette Verschuren]

That is correct.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

You're the chair of MaRS, in Toronto, which I believe gets about a third of its financing from the industry department. Is that correct?

[Annette Verschuren]

Yes. MaRS is a not-for-profit organization—

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

I know it is.

[Annette Verschuren]

—that does receive money from the federal government and the provincial government.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

According to your financial [Inaudible—Editor], it's about a third of your budget.

Has MaRS, which you chair, given NRStor and its project with Oneida and Hydrostor any taxpayer money?

[Annette Verschuren]

I do not believe that MaRS gave NRStor and Hydrostor any taxpayer money.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

You have not benefited, and the companies you own that are associated with projects like Oneida, have not received any money whatsoever from MaRS, one-third of which is funded by the federal government. Is that correct?

[Annette Verschuren]

That's correct.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

Okay.

If I have the correct number, you got $170 million from the Infrastructure Bank and $50 million from Natural Resources Canada. That's a lot of money. Outside of that, it appears to be very profitable to be connected with these Liberals and to be on the SDTC board and do their bidding so that other Liberals can get money, and then, in return, in other government organizations, your projects got money. It's a lot of taxpayer money.

[The Chair, Liberal, Joël Lightbound]

I'm not sure there was a question there, Mr. Perkins, but that's all the time you have. Thank you.

Mr. Turnbull, the floor is yours.

[Ryan Turnbull, Liberal, Whitby, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Ms. Verschuren, thanks for being here today.

You have said multiple times that you followed correct procedures, and you've also said that you accept the Ethics Commissioner's report and the Auditor General's report and findings, and that you in fact abstained from votes when you should have recused yourself. Do you regret not having recused yourself?

[Annette Verschuren]

Mr. Chair, yes, if I had to do it over again, I would have absolutely recused myself. I just was not aware of the difference between abstaining and recusing.

[Ryan Turnbull, Liberal, Whitby, ON]

I have a list of quite a number of appointments that you've had over the years, going all the way back to 1987, when Brian Mulroney appointed you to the national advisory board on Science and Technology . When you were on that national advisory board, did you declare conflicts of interest, and did you abstain, versus recusing yourself, in situations during those regular board practices?

[Annette Verschuren]

Mr. Chair, that advisory board was chaired by the former prime minister, and the objective of that board was to work with the American counterparts, an equivalent number of people, to bring and to develop science and technology in both of our countries. There weren't decisions made, other than advice being given to both governments.

[Ryan Turnbull, Liberal, Whitby, ON]

I get that. Then there were no funding decisions made, so you didn't have to abstain or recuse yourself from anything because there were no votes taken. Is that right?

[Annette Verschuren]

That's correct.

[Ryan Turnbull, Liberal, Whitby, ON]

Okay. What about when Stephen Harper appointed you to the North American Competitiveness Council? I know that was another appointment you received. Did you, in the regular practices of that council, have to abstain or recuse yourself in any situations, and did you declare conflicts of interest, perceived or real, that occurred in any of the council's undertakings?

[Annette Verschuren]

Mr. Chair, there was a similar circumstance with former prime minister Stephen Harper. He asked me and a number of other Canadian leaders to join him in Mexico and to work with him to open trade barriers between our three countries.