Evidence of meeting #146 for Industry, Science and Technology in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was turnbull.
A recording is available from Parliament.
November 21st, 2024 / 9:25 a.m.
Liberal
Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON
We had hoped, obviously, that we would be back on Bill C-27 after that particular study. I know that Mr. Masse is asking questions about that, and we've been working very diligently to come up with options to get back to Bill C-27.
I think that if that's a priority for a number of individuals, to me that would be the preference when we get back, after the study Mr. Généreux mentioned, which I think we've now clarified as the order from the House, that we need to study—
Liberal
Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON
Yes. He's adding “right after”, which would suggest the committee.... I would respectfully oppose that, because I would like to be back on Bill C-27 immediately following that.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Joël Lightbound
To be clear, this is all when we come back in January, because we're not getting there this session.
On the subamendment by Monsieur Généreux, I have Monsieur Généreux.
Conservative
Bernard Généreux Conservative Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC
Basically, I don't share my colleague's opinion.
We're talking about holding two meetings for this study. As far as the study of Bill C‑27 is concerned, I don't think that holding two meetings will change things considerably. I think it would be important for us to do this study as soon as we come back in January, or in February. In fact, in January, we'll have barely two days. Do we have a meeting scheduled for January? We'll probably have one or two at the beginning of the year.
I don't think it changes the agenda for Bill C‑27. In any case, until the minister responds to our requests and says what he wants to do about the proposed amendments, we honestly can't work on or even plan to work on Bill C-27.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Joël Lightbound
Okay.
Do any members want to speak to Mr. Généreux's subamendment?
Mr. Arya, you have the floor.
Liberal
Chandra Arya Liberal Nepean, ON
On this subamendment, Mr. Chair, my preference would be to deal with Bill C-27 at the earliest. I'll speak to this motion later.
NDP
Brian Masse NDP Windsor West, ON
Well, I started this meeting raising this exact point.
Maybe we could get, from the clerk, the exact timeline for when the Liberals broke off Bill C-27, so we can take a recess to find out whether or not.... We've been waiting for these amendments for four months, perhaps. I'd like to know specifically how many months it has been, because, magically, they seem to be suggesting to us that they're going to have amendments within a few weeks, even though I specifically asked for that over and over.
Now we're getting the Liberals opposing a specific thing we have to work on today in our calendar, because now they say amendments are going to come, after being quiet about it all meeting. We have to do our planning. Here we are back again. I think it has been four months. Off the top of my head, I'm just remembering when we broke off Bill C-27. We were promised all of these different things. I don't know how I'm supposed to even.... Mr. Généreux offered an amendment for us to do something. We're supposed to, I guess, have some faith that we're going to get some amendments and hold up from.... When the minister came here, he didn't even have amendments. He had ideas. Then, finally, we got into amendments, and that took about a year.
Now we're supposed to scuttle all of our planning for this meeting. Maybe we should recess the meeting. I should bring back a motion for you to find out from the minister, specifically. At this point, I, too, would like to know why it's taken so long. This is the challenge we have. I think the member is making a legitimate motion here that is important. Then we're supposed to disregard it. I don't understand the logic on the other side here. I really don't.
I guess I'm going to support the subamendment, based on all these things. I'm not going to wait for this unicorn to pop up with regard to having the amendments written for us while we're supposed to put all of our lives on hold again.
Liberal
NDP
Brian Masse NDP Windsor West, ON
I'd rather just get on with stuff. Even with the last motion, I was glad Ms. Rempel Garner brought back the compromise we had so we can get stuff done and move along. However, we can't when we have this kind of stuff going on.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Joël Lightbound
Thank you, Mr. Masse. You've been heard.
On the subamendment still, I have MP Rempel Garner.
Conservative
Michelle Rempel Conservative Calgary Nose Hill, AB
Thank you.
I just want to echo Mr. Masse's comments. I mean, are there amendments coming? Come on. If there were going to be amendments, they would have tabled them by now. My sense is that the minister is very busy planning his leadership bid and announcing money we don't have for other initiatives that haven't even been approved in the estimates yet.
I think the safe bet is to assume there aren't amendments and agree with Mr. Masse that we need to get on with planning the business of this committee. Then, if the minister wants to surprise us and drop amendments today, wow. That would be something, wouldn't it?
Conservative
Conservative
Michelle Rempel Conservative Calgary Nose Hill, AB
We could. We could change our schedule if that were to happen.
However, I think the safe bet here is that he's out on a fundraising tour, trying to get ready for a leadership change. We should move forward.
Thank you.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Joël Lightbound
Okay. If I don't have any more speakers, let's put the subamendment to a vote.
Mr. Turnbull, did you want to speak to the subamendment?
Liberal
Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON
I just want to say that Francis Bilodeau is not the current acting deputy minister at ISED, so you might want to change that.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Joël Lightbound
We can get back to that after the subamendment has been dealt with. Let's deal with the subamendment first.
We will now vote on Mr. Généreux's subamendment.
Madam Clerk, you have the floor.
(Subamendment agreed to: yeas 6; nays 5 [See Minutes of Proceedings])
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Joël Lightbound
It makes your amendment moot, Mr. Turnbull, because now we have a time frame that's outlined in the subamendment, which takes us back to the main motion, as amended.
Mr. Turnbull.
Liberal
Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON
Just for accuracy, it would be good to include the deputy minister, Philip Jennings, who I believe would be the right person to actually have come as a witness.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Joël Lightbound
That's, I think, a fair change that doesn't need to be discussed.
On the main motion, do I have any more speakers?
Mr. Arya.
Liberal
Chandra Arya Liberal Nepean, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Whenever government provides loans, it has to be of very strategic value to Canada and Canadians. Our government has stepped in throughout the history of the Canadian government system. At least during the last 20-25 years, we have seen many times government step in and support private businesses through loans, grants and other means.
Telesat is a private sector company funded by venture capitalists. Typically, if they have a business case, commercial banks should be able to step in and fund the business. If the government is coming in and providing this huge loan of $2.1 billion, obviously I'm interested to know the reason behind it. I do support this motion, so that we can look into it. There's nothing to indicate that there's anything wrong in the government decision. My only thought is that we need to know more about the reasons why the government stepped in to support a private sector company. Although a point has been made that the majority ownership lies with U.S. entities, that in itself should not be an issue if there are benefits to Canada and Canadian technologies. If the implementation of whatever project Telesat is undertaking is going to be in Canada, that will stimulate technological development and add to the technological capabilities of Canada.
I don't see any problem there. However, for me to understand in more detail the reasoning behind why this loan has been given to Telesat, I would support this motion.
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Joël Lightbound
Thank you, MP Arya.
Do I have any more speakers?
I gather from the room that there is unanimous support for the motion as amended. If no one objects, then I understand that the motion is adopted, as amended by Mr. Généreux.
(Motion as amended agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])
Thank you very much, colleagues.
Now on my list, I have MP Savard-Tremblay.
Bloc
Simon-Pierre Savard-Tremblay Bloc Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I also have a study motion for a short study. It will be emailed to you right now. You'll receive it in both languages.
Would you prefer to wait until you receive it?
