Evidence of meeting #74 for Subcommittee on International Human Rights in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was commission.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
David Sweet Conservative Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON
Did Mr. Zelaya give your commission a reason why he would not testify?
As an Individual
It's possible. I don't know if he specifically stated it, but our sense was he felt that the commission had been created by the Lobo government and that the Lobo government, in the party Resistencia’s view, was an illegitimate government because it had been created out of the period of time of the Micheletti government. The feeling was that the elections were not free and fair. Therefore, the Lobo government had no legitimacy and therefore a commission created as a result of that government had no standing.
Conservative
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Scott Reid
Thank you.
Mr. Scott, I'm going to shorten the time a little bit on this. You have just one question. Please go ahead.
NDP
Craig Scott NDP Toronto—Danforth, ON
Mr. Kergin, I was just wondering—Mr. Sweet brought up the inter-penetration of powerful economic elites. It almost is in the hands of a core set of families and it goes out from there, and how that inter-penetrates the political process. You described it well yourself.
I want to ask you for your frank view. Can we in Canada, with our extensive mining interests and mining expertise, get involved in Honduras in light of the way that economy works, in terms of inter-penetration of the political elites, the almost complete lack of rule of law? I know you understand the difficulties of mining investing overseas. Do you have anything to tell us about Canadian mining in Honduras? Is there a cautionary tale that we need to keep in mind?
As an Individual
I think there is a cautionary tale in the sense that—and it's not just in Honduras, but many of our mining companies would be well advised to have a more open and more respectful dialogue with some of the aboriginal groups or people who are in the area where they're doing the work.
Certainly in Honduras there are concerns about environmental questions on mining and so on. To the extent that Honduras needs foreign exchange and economic interests are involved, it would seem to me that there's a propensity for the government not to be quite as strict about environmental safeguards as one might want or certainly the locals of that area would like to see.
It is a question of whether a foreign mining concern, such as a Canadian one, would go further and be more rigorous with respect to the rules that are on paper or in law, but are often not respected either because of lack of implementation or, to some extent, possibly money changing hands and so forth. If a Canadian mining firm were playing by the rules and had an open dialogue with local groups, it would be acceptable practice. But there's also a propensity in those countries for people to cut corners and to cut costs. They do that by not being as strict with the rules as perhaps they should be when they're on paper.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Scott Reid
That was three minutes.
Mr. Sweet, I'll give you an equivalent amount of time.
Conservative
David Sweet Conservative Ancaster—Dundas—Flamborough—Westdale, ON
I have one brief question, and I'd like Mr. Sierra and Mr. Kergin to answer it. Maybe we'll go to Mr. Sierra first, since he's been waiting on the line.
Do you feel that enough effort has been put into the recommendations from a truth and reconciliation commission by the Lobo government? Are they taking it seriously and moving ahead with the recommendations?
Conservative
As an Individual
Very well.
From here they prepared a plan concerning the 84 recommendations. Of the 84 recommendations, 65 are related to the responsibility of one of the state institutions. The rest have to do with the OAS, with the international community. They also affect political parties and the Civil Society Organizations. Of the 65 recommendations that are the responsibility of the state, in one way or another, 57 are the responsibility of the National Congress, or the Congress of the Republic.
Currently, if we observe the process of compliance with these recommendations, 26 of the 84 recommendations have been complied with: 3 regarding constitutional affairs, 11 regarding human rights, 4 regarding the war on corruption. And there are other recommendations on the electoral system and the media.
Furthermore, there are currently 42 recommendations that are in the process of compliance. In other words, there are 42 recommendations within different areas that are still in the process of being complied with. There has been a low level of compliance, particularly regarding international aspects. That, of course, relates to the OAS and international cooperation. We should underscore that there has been an impact on compliance, but we cannot say that the impact has been immediate in respect of recommendations, proposed constitutional changes, legislative changes, or the drafting of new laws and new public policy.
Now, there has been progress, but we're quite clear about the fact that Hondurans and the international community require monitoring and follow-up with the state of Honduras, so that the progress that may come about actually translates into a strengthening of democratic institutions, a strengthening of the state of the law, and a more democratic and participative society.
Conservative
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Scott Reid
Thank you, Mr. Sierra.
To the other committee members, I'm not going to see the clock as being at two o'clock until we've heard from Mr. Kergin in response to this question.
Mr. Kergin.
As an Individual
I hate to disappoint you, but I just haven't followed Honduras since I left, so I can't say whether they have made progress. I do understand, however, that some of our recommendations require legislation, and legislation, like any parliamentary process, takes time. Some of the recommendations were fairly far-reaching. Particularly time-consuming are recommendations dealing with constitutional change, which is what we suggested in a number of areas. For these reasons, I'm not in a position, regrettably, to tell you whether or not Honduras has made that much progress on our report.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Scott Reid
Thank you.
That completes all the time we have available for testimony. I would like to do some follow up with both Mr. Kergin and Mr. Scott afterwards about getting some written materials. Perhaps I can speak to you offline.
In the meantime, Mr. Sierra, we thank you very much for having attended and for giving your testimony. All members of the committee want to express their gratitude.