Justice Committee on Oct. 18th, 2006

[Barbara Merriam]

No. With the joint funding between the Department of Justice and Health Canada, we just have sufficient funding for six courts in total. We're hoping that through some of our other activities...for example, right now there is a national drug treatment court conference taking place in Edmonton. Representatives from all the courts are there, along with others who are involved in drug treatment courts--prosecutors, health care providers, experts from the United States. We're hoping that through these venues we can share some of the lessons learned.

[Donald Piragoff]

I should add that some of the courts are quite new. For example, Regina hasn't even started. They're just in the process of starting.

There is an evaluation component built into each of these courts. Part of the program is to undertake evaluation, so to some extent the six that exist should not necessarily be seen as exclusive or as the only six. We extended the pilot project from two to six. We will continue to evaluate the six, and if the evaluations prove positive, then I think the government will possibly consider providing more funding for expansion.

I think the government is taking an incremental approach first, in terms of having a number of pilot projects, evaluating them, making assessments, and then determining how best to proceed in the future.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Are there timelines as to when the evaluations will be sufficiently complete for the department to consider expansion?

[Barbara Merriam]

We have signed agreements with the six courts that go until March 31, 2009, and from now until then, each court is responsible for doing its own evaluation. But we're also doing national evaluations and we're tracking the types of participants in the different courts, who stays in, who leaves. Probably solid information would be available in that last fiscal year, 2008-09.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

In terms of the people participating in the evaluation, do they include judges and police and defence counsel?

[Barbara Merriam]

Yes. The funding may go to the provincial governments, but they work closely with the courts, the community stakeholders, the health care providers; or if the contribution goes to a particular health-serving organization, again all the players work together. For example, all the players are out in Edmonton right now, including the judges.

[Catherine Latimer, General Counsel and Director General, Department of Justice]

Were you asking whether or not the judges are participating in the actual evaluation?

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Yes.

[Catherine Latimer]

That would depend on the evaluation model the various groups have determined. Normally you would--

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

I'm sorry, there's not a standard model for all of them?

[Catherine Latimer]

I don't believe there is, is there?

[Barbara Merriam]

There would be a standard model when we look at the national picture. At one point in the formative or summative evaluation, we would have interviews with key participants, and judges are definitely key participants in this whole process.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

So when we get the annual reports, they flow out of those local evaluations, I'm assuming.

Mr. Chair, I'm not clear, and I know we've had some discussion about the Law Commission. Is it permissible for me to ask questions on the Law Commission of these witnesses ?

[The Chair, Conservative, Art Hanger]

I'm not going to hold you to any line of questioning, Mr. Comartin, unless it's way off topic.

[The Chair, Conservative, Art Hanger]

Whether the question could be answered or not is another matter.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

With regard to the Law Commission, the same points on evaluation. Does the department do the evaluation of the Law Commission and of the individual projects it does?

[Catherine Latimer]

As you probably know, the Law Commission was a product of a federal statute and they gave annual reports to Parliament.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

It still is.

[Catherine Latimer]

There's a different requirement for accountability if it's a grant and contribution agreement, which is what the drug courts are under. So the accountability of the Law Commission is a different model.

We would not necessarily be evaluating the reports that come out of the Law Commission. They would be seen as valuable input to law reform activities that the Department of Justice might be looking at, and there certainly is the possibility of responding to the ones.... Previously, the Department of Justice could request specific work from the Law Commission as well, but it's a different type of model.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

How do you determine how much money you are giving the Law Commission? There must be some criteria. You just don't throw $3 million a year at them, I'm assuming.

[Donald Piragoff]

It's a statutory-based agency. I don't have the details as to how the annual funding is determined. The minister is responsible to Parliament for the agency, but it is an agency, a creature of Parliament.

Our experts on the Law Commission are not here, Mr. Chairman, because you indicated this item was supposed to be on the agenda but it was taken off, so we released our experts.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

He took it off, but the committee put it back on.

[Donald Piragoff]

We were not informed that it would be back on today, so we released our expert from coming here. I apologize if there was some mistake on our part.

[The Chair, Conservative, Art Hanger]

There was no mistake on your part at all, sir. In fact, the matter was to be brought before the steering committee, and the steering committee was to discuss it further. Unfortunately, we couldn't get the members of the steering committee together in time, although we have been trying to do so. That is the point of the Law Commission and that issue coming before the committee, but it has yet to be decided.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Is there somebody within the department who would be able to answer those questions?