My other area of questioning is related to the mandatory minimums. Of course, you probably notice we have a difference of opinion on this point in committee.
Generally, most of the witnesses who came before us as experts working with criminals and victims on the ground said they don't work, that in fact they could increase crime. By putting it in this way, we could actually be increasing auto thefts in Canada, which none of the opposition parties, at least, would want, and we also have a majority of the votes on the committee.
What we want is for the judge to have access to stiff penalties, but when you get these repeat offenders, people who are incorrigible, or people who don't undergo the treatment, we're lobbying to have more treatment in the prisons. Obviously that would be a much better way of stopping them. When they come out, they don't reoffend--but everyone comes out, and if you have someone in there for longer than they should be through a mandatory minimum and they learn how to be a better car thief, that's no help.
If the bill had to go through basically as it is, with steep penalties--and they're high-end penalties, so the judge can put them away for a long time--but there wasn't a minimum for those cases in which there are other and better ways of stopping the person from stealing more cars, would that compromise at least be better than nothing?