Justice Committee on May 27th, 2010

[Myles Kirvan]

I don't know if I have the precise answer, but really, in terms of how the funding works, as programs come to an end and then they're renewed, sometimes there is sunsetting and all the rest of it. You go through a process. As that approval comes through, it may come through after the main estimates as the program extends—aside from the regular A-base of the department—or it can come through supplementary estimates (A) or (B). And as the minister talked about earlier, in terms of other spending, some of that other spending would come later in the supply process.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

I just have a little problem with that in the sense that this fund has been in existence for three years or four years.

[Rob Nicholson, Conservative, Niagara Falls, ON]

We started about—

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

2005?

[Rob Nicholson, Conservative, Niagara Falls, ON]

—three years ago.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Okay.

At any rate, that was just a comment.

[Rob Nicholson, Conservative, Niagara Falls, ON]

The money is there, and I will provide a breakdown of exactly where it is.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Thank you, Minister, for that.

Mr. Minister, you just got me a letter in response to questions we asked you back on March 23. I just received it early yesterday. My question was with regard to the additional funding, if any, that was going to be required to just prosecute the Controlled Drugs and Substances Act. Your response to that was that there is going to be approximately $33.5 million over five years, just for that one piece of legislation.

But then at the end of the paragraph, in response to that question, you say that the funding is held in “a frozen allotment”. I have to admit that I don't know what that means. Is it anywhere in the estimates? Is either the one-fifth, the $33.5 million, in the estimates anyplace, or has it been budgeted somewhere?

[Rob Nicholson, Conservative, Niagara Falls, ON]

It's budgeted within the public prosecution service. I was responding inasmuch...even though it's not directly within the Department of Justice, you did ask the question, and so we did, and it's indicated that it's within there.

Mr. Kirvan, did you have an—

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Deputy Minister, is that additional money or is it being taken out of some other line item?

[Myles Kirvan]

On the first part of the question, the bill is in the Senate. You have a frozen allotment until such time as it's through to be able to spend that money.

In terms of whether it's new money in the estimates, yes, it's new money.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Okay.

[Myles Kirvan]

As the minister said, it's the public prosecution service--just to be helpful.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Will it show up as a separate line item in public prosecution? The bill has to come back to the House again because of prorogation. Is it—

[Rob Nicholson, Conservative, Niagara Falls, ON]

Listen, I've got my hands full with the estimates of the Department of Justice. As to whether this is a separate line under public prosecution, my understanding is that it is, but again, we'll have a look at that.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Just to speed this up, Mr. Minister, perhaps your office can simply let us know when it shows up on a budget line.

[Rob Nicholson, Conservative, Niagara Falls, ON]

Yes, I have no problem with that.

[A voice]

It will show up in the estimates.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Okay.

Just to pursue this line, with regard to some of the other legislation that you've mentioned today and that's coming, but specifically with regard to Bill C-4 and Bill C-16, I guess it would be, has this type of an analysis been made as to whether there will be additional cost to the public prosecution office or to your department for the implementation of these new crime bills?

[Rob Nicholson, Conservative, Niagara Falls, ON]

It's fair to say the resources are in place. I mean, yes, we are getting more money this year. The budget of the Department of Justice has increased. But again, I have complete confidence that we have the resources to meet any additional needs, that this is part of our ongoing responsibilities to the public.

Again, many of these are prosecuted by provincial authorities, of course, and they're well aware of the direction we're taking.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

I'm sorry, maybe I didn't make my question clear enough.

What I was asking was that when a bill is presented, and we'll use Bill C-4 as an example, is it customary for an analysis to be done as to how much it's going to cost your department for that bill to be implemented, assuming it's implemented in full?

[Rob Nicholson, Conservative, Niagara Falls, ON]

Again, Mr. Comartin, as I've answered on a number of occasions, it's very difficult to be precise on these to see, whether faint hope or any of these things, exactly what they cost. I get asked about this on a regular basis. We are in consultation with public prosecution in terms of what we are planning to do, and we get their assurances to move forward.

I raise these matters on a regular basis with my provincial counterparts to ensure that everybody is onside with these things, but it's very difficult. So to say there's a precise analysis on exactly how much something is going to cost, there isn't on these things, other than the fact that we know they take resources.

I'm pleased to see that the budget of the Department of Justice continues to increase, and we will maintain the services and we will respond to the needs of the future.

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Fast]

Thank you.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

One more question--

[The Chair, Conservative, Ed Fast]

You'll get a chance.

The clerk has just clarified that the supplementary estimates (A) are going out this afternoon. They have been received by her office. They'll be sent out this afternoon to each member.

Again, just to clarify our agreement, because the minister is only here for one hour, it was agreed by the committee that the government would not ask questions.

We're going to go to Mr. Regan for five minutes.