Justice Committee on June 3rd, 2021

[Heidi Illingworth]

Yes. I hear every day from frontline service providers who are concerned about technology abuse, especially in intimate partner scenarios. We hear a lot about this when it comes to young people and not having consent for sharing intimate images. This is an ongoing concern for sure, and a violation of people's rights. When they're being stalked and harassed through technology, they're very fearful, which causes immense fear as well.

We need to do more to recognize all the harms that can come from social media and that people access different forms of technology to commit further abuses against victims, particularly in the context of intimate relationships. Again, we need to ensure there is training on these issues so that the people responding understand how serious these are and that people who are going through this need support. It's a matter of safety, in many instances. We don't want things to escalate to the point of serious violence or someone being killed, which has happened in the past.

[Chris Lewis, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Thank you very much.

Madam Chair, what do I have left, about one minute?

Thank you very much.

I have one final question, Ms. Illingworth. Can you expand or talk about the restitution orders? I know you mentioned those in your opening remarks. Talk about the restitution orders and how government should assist in the enforcement of court-ordered restitution.

Thank you.

[Heidi Illingworth]

I am happy to.

This is one of our concerns, and we have a special report coming out on this issue later this year.

Victims of crime tell us that when they have a court order for restitution, depending on where they live, it falls upon the victim to enforce this order. People tell us that they have to hire lawyers to garnishee wages. They have to figure out where offenders are living and they have to serve them with papers and hire legal representation, all at additional costs when they are trying to recoup what was stolen from them or the losses they suffered during the crime. This is problematic.

We know that some provinces have programs that assist with enforcement and collection of restitution and that these are very successful. Saskatchewan, British Columbia and, I think, Nova Scotia have these programs, but we need to see programs implemented in all the provinces and territories to help victims collect what the court has ordered.

[The Chair, Liberal, Iqra Khalid]

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Lewis.

We'll now go to Mr. Sarai for five minutes.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Ms. Illingworth.

In the 2020 progress report on the Canadian Victims Bill of Rights, you mentioned that the vast majority of persons who are victimized by crime in Canada choose not to engage or cannot engage in the justice system. How, in your opinion, might strengthening the bill of rights impact the willingness of those who are able to engage with the justice system?

[Heidi Illingworth]

I think it's really important to acknowledge that people don't trust the justice system right now. People are fearful about coming forward as they feel they won't be believed. They've seen how other survivors are responded to.

If we strengthen victims' rights, if we ensure that victims have the ability to enforce their rights to make sure they can seek a remedy if their rights are overlooked, that will give people increased confidence that the system is going to take them seriously when they come forward, and that people are actually responsible for not causing further harm.

That's really important. Right now we hear a lot from especially newcomer families, indigenous families, and racialized families and individuals that they don't feel safe to come forward to report what has happened to them.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

I'm sorry to interrupt. It's just because of the time.

How do you think we could actually, in concrete terms, enable them to do so?

I have a riding that includes everyone you just described. How do you empower them to come forward to not only utilize their rights but also voice their pain and their issues?

[Heidi Illingworth]

We need to improve training in cultural humility for officials. We need to have more third party reporting programs that allow victims to go to community agencies that they trust and that they have been working with to help them to report crime to the police.

When people start to see that they actually have rights that are real and not just statements of principles, and that others can be held accountable for overlooking their rights, for example, then perhaps when we amend the act eventually through a judicial review or through other administrative reviews, people will be confident that they're going to be taken seriously; they're going to be believed, and they're going to be supported as they go through the system because there has been a change of culture in the system to respect victims' rights in law.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

Thank you.

In recommendation 11 of that progress report, you suggested having a national public education campaign, using TV and social media to inform Canadians of their rights as victims of crime.

Can you elaborate more on how this might look and what else we can do to ensure that Canadians know their rights, especially those who may have become victims of crime, and that they understand what resources are available to them?

[Heidi Illingworth]

Yes, this is a critically important gap that we had following the passage of the bill, and we continue to hear, as I said, that people just don't know that they have rights as victims of crime. We need to put some funding into public education campaigns, public legal education around the rights that people have should they be victimized.

Nobody ever expects this is going to happen to them, so when it does, they are thrust into a really complex system. If we can increase the public awareness of the rights that people have, they're going to be less marginalized. They're going to feel more comfortable to come forward. They'll think, “Oh, wait a minute. I heard this somewhere. Maybe it was on TV, on the radio, on social media, or on Facebook somewhere, but I do have rights,” and they can better recognize what is happening to them. Maybe it is abuse or violence. They can come forward to seek help and feel that the system is going to take them seriously and support them as they move forward.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

Thank you.

How much time do I have, Madam Chair?

[The Chair, Liberal, Iqra Khalid]

You have 15 seconds.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

Okay, thank you. I'll pass it over to the next colleague.

[The Chair, Liberal, Iqra Khalid]

Thank you very much, Mr. Sarai.

We'll go to Monsieur Fortin for two and a half minutes.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Ms. Illingworth, I'd like to get your comments on the victims of crimes committed abroad. Are Canadians and Quebeckers who are victims of a crime committed abroad also covered by the programs established under the Canadian Victims Bill of Rights?

Furthermore, do Canadians and Quebeckers who are themselves abroad and who are victims of a crime benefit from some protection or services under the bill of rights?

[Heidi Illingworth]

Thank you for that.

The Canadian Victims Bill of Rights only applies to crimes committed in Canada, so Canadians and Quebeckers who are victimized when they are travelling or living outside of the country do not fall under this bill because it applies to our justice system in the context of our criminal justice system. However, there is a funding program through the Department of Justice that allows victims to access some emergency financial assistance when they've been victimized abroad, outside of Canada.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

In your opinion, Ms. Illingworth, is that satisfactory as it is, or is that the kind of thing that should be changed?

Do you think the Canadian Victims Bill of Rights should include a provision for people who are victims of crimes committed abroad?

[Heidi Illingworth]

This is a tough question because it's difficult for Canada to.... Canada can't give rights to people in other criminal justice contexts, so I think that is why it wasn't included.

What we suggested in our progress report to address this issue is that if we amend the bill to guarantee support services to all victims of crime, that would allow people who are victimized outside of Canada to, when they come back home, be able to seek support through services that are on the ground in the community in which they live, or federal services or what have you. It would ensure that people can get support when they're at home and are aware that they can get funding to travel back to participate in criminal justice processes abroad as well.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Have you received a lot of requests for—

[The Chair, Liberal, Iqra Khalid]

Thank you, Mr. Fortin.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Iqra Khalid]

Thank you, Monsieur Fortin.

Mr. Garrison, you have two and a half minutes. Please go ahead.

[Randall Garrison, NDP, Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

It appears I'm having some Internet connection problems here on my end, but I will go ahead and try.

Ms. Illingworth, in recommendation 8 of your report from last November, you talk about making the Office of the Federal Ombudsman for Victims of Crime “the single authority with jurisdiction to review complaints by victims of crime” with regard to any federal department or agency.

My question is about your relationship with the Department of National Defence sexual misconduct response centre and things that I've heard at the defence committee as the defence critic about a lack of confidence in that centre and its independence.

[Heidi Illingworth]

The recommendation in our report is more around the process of making complaints for victims, which is very complex. They first have to complain to the agency that they are having an issue with. Then, if they're not satisfied with the response they receive, they can come to our office, for example. A lot of times, victims are discouraged from making complaints in the first place. The processes are overwhelming. There's a lot of paperwork to be completed.

So the idea around that recommendation was to have one office where it's very clear that victims of crime can make a complaint and try to have it resolved, just to make the system more trauma-informed and sensitive to people. It's asking a lot to file a complaint and go through those processes and wait those out.

With regard to the SMRC, I know they're doing good work to support survivors. We direct military sexual trauma victims there if they contact our office. I do understand that there's some hesitation, because they report to the chain of command. I think the SMRC does a lot of really good work when it comes to counselling and support and things like that. That's a very important service. But when we're talking about complaints about bigger systems like that, there needs to be an outside office that can take those and review those independently.

[Randall Garrison, NDP, Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC]

Thank you.