Justice Committee on Oct. 31st, 2024

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

Mr. Mendicino.

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

I echo the sentiments of Mr. Maloney.

While I'm sympathetic to Mr. Brock's point that he is not Mr. Viersen's scheduler, I go back to your original comment, which was that it was reported at one point that Mr. Viersen had no intention of appearing before this committee, which, in the words of Mr. MacGregor, which I'm paraphrasing, does raise questions about his ongoing support for his own legislation.

Given the objective of the legislation, which would have been studied and examined by this committee were Mr. Viersen, its sponsor, to have appeared, through its questioning of that individual, I do think that, at a minimum, it raises questions about his ongoing commitment to this legislation.

I take the update at face value if he says he's open to the invitation. I certainly would encourage Mr. Viersen to accept that invitation and appear before this committee as quickly as possible, so that we can get on with the business of studying that legislation, given its important objective.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

I have Mr. Maloney, and then I have Mr. Brock.

[James Maloney, Liberal, Etobicoke—Lakeshore, ON]

Thanks, Madam Chair.

Now that we know that Mr. Viersen's open to the invitation, we're hoping to get an answer as soon as possible. However, this issue of dealing with the bill has taken longer than anticipated for the reasons we're talking about, so I would like to move another motion:

That the committee request an extension of 30 sitting days to the period of committee consideration for Bill C-270.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

Mr. Brock.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

We have unanimous agreement on motion number one for the invitation. I encourage the chair to move forthwith to issue a formal invitation to Mr. Viersen.

I now wish to move another motion, and that is a dilatory motion to proceed to business of committee.

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

You can't. We're in debate.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

No, this is a dilatory motion.

I move that we move to the order of business of the day, which is to return to the anti-Semitic study. That is the primary purpose—

[Julie Dabrusin, Liberal, Toronto—Danforth, ON]

I'll just correct you, so that you don't think that we're actually doing an “anti-Semitic” study. I just wanted to correct that.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

I have the floor, Ms. Dabrusin. Thank you for the interruptions.

My understanding is that this is a dilatory motion. The clerk is acknowledging in the affirmative that it is, and I wish to move on to the anti-Semitic study.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

It's “anti-Semitism”. That's what they're trying to....

Yes, we will move on to that. Let me just clear up the record.

The clerk will send another invitation to Mr. Viersen to appear. As you all know, and just as a reminder, an invitation had already been sent previously for him to appear, but we will send another one again today.

Now, I think what I will do is declare the public part closed.

[Some hon. members]

We need to vote.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

Oh, we need to vote. I'm sorry. Okay.

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Let's cut the chair some slack. She's a little under the weather this morning.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

All right. Can we please vote, then, on Mr. Brock's motion?

(Motion negatived: nays 6; yeas 5)

I think that takes us back to the motion to request an extension for 30 sitting days.

Mr. Maloney, please.

[James Maloney, Liberal, Etobicoke—Lakeshore, ON]

Madam Chair, we can get back to the order of things that we're discussing, including the study on anti-Semitism, within minutes if we pass this motion.

We have clear agreement from the other side that they want Mr. Viersen to be here. We're simply allowing for an extension of time to accommodate what obviously is a very busy schedule.

We don't need to debate this motion. It's a yes or no. We can get on with it and get back to the business at hand, so if there's any further discussion on this, I can only interpret it as an attempt to prevent Mr. Viersen from attending this committee, because there's no other way to look at it.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

I have Mr. MacGregor, Ms. Ferreri and then [Inaudible—Editor]

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

I saw this scenario play out before with Bill S-210 at the public safety committee. There was a Conservative filibuster at the public safety committee, which prevented us from completing our study with witnesses and prevented the committee from doing a clause-by-clause review of the bill. We reached the deadline, and the bill was automatically reported back to the House.

If we don't extend this, we're going to face a similar situation with Bill C-270.

Again, if we just had a simple “yes” vote on this, I think it would be very reasonable to ask for an extension. What I think is completely unacceptable is for this committee to completely abandon its duty to do a fulsome study of each piece of legislation that comes before it. We need to have witnesses. If Mr. Viersen doesn't want to come, that's fine. We can proceed with other witnesses.

I will not tolerate a delay on this bill that prevents us from doing due diligence and a thorough clause-by-clause review. Reporting it back to the House without doing a study would be a dereliction of the duties of this committee. I think we should vote for the extension.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

Ms. Ferreri.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

What's happening here today, for the folks watching, is an unfolding of what we've seen repeatedly since the time I was elected, but I'm sure it's been like this longer than I've been here. It's a deflection of accountability. That's ultimately the big conversation that has to happen on a bigger scale.

It's ironic that you have Mr. Maloney, who sits on this committee, writing a tweet asking if the leader is gagging us. It is no secret to the public that there are 24 Liberal MPs who have signed a letter asking for the resignation of the Prime Minister. The tie-in to this, when we're talking about this motion, is that there is a lack of accountability and there is deflection across all fronts. That comes from the top down. That is what we see repeatedly, over and over again.

I want to point out that when we're looking at anti-Semitism, I look at Mr. Housefather, who has stood up as a Liberal MP, trying to fight against a caucus that has blatantly insulted him, quite frankly. We have a colleague, Marty Morantz, who is a fierce fighter for the Jewish community.

There is data that reveals that anti-Semitic hate crimes are up 400%. Since when, Madam Chair? Since Justin Trudeau took office. That's since when.

Let's talk about that. Let's talk about the rise in anti-Semitism since Justin Trudeau took office. Let's talk about sexual assaults, which are up 75% since Justin Trudeau took office. Let's talk about sexual violations against children, which are up 119% since Justin Trudeau took office. Let's talk about forcible confinement or kidnapping, which are up 11% since Justin Trudeau took office. Let's talk about indecent, harassing communications, which are up 86% since Justin Trudeau took office. Let's talk about—

[James Maloney, Liberal, Etobicoke—Lakeshore, ON]

On a point of order, I haven't the slightest idea what this has to do with the motion we're debating right now.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

I don't either, quite frankly.

Can you tell me the relevance? Otherwise, I'm going to have to ask you to speak on the motion requesting 30 sitting days to study the bill before we send it back to the House.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Can you repeat that again for me, Madam Chair? Repeat it for clarity and my own self.

What's the motion that you think doesn't have relevance to what I'm saying?

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

The motion that you are speaking to, or are supposed to be speaking to, is this:

That the committee request an extension of 30 sitting days to the period of committee consideration for Bill C-270.

If that motion does not pass, we risk not being able to study this bill here in committee.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

I think everything I've just said is extremely relevant, Madam Chair, and to the member across the way, I say this: Let's study a bill that is going to help change the Criminal Code, so that you don't have violent repeat offenders under legislation that the Liberals put in place with Bill C-75, which brought in catch and release. The most heinous of criminals, who I know the member opposite—