Justice Committee on Dec. 2nd, 2024

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

There absolutely is empirical evidence of worsening crime statistics. I acknowledge that fully.

When we're concerned about people's perception of crime, it's about their confidence in our institutions. When we have decisions being rendered...and underinvestment, it erodes that confidence. I would point to some of the interventions I made earlier about the need to ensure we have enough police officers, Crown attorneys, courtrooms, court space and detention facilities to house individuals. It's not lost on me that 81% of those arrested in Ontario are on remand right now awaiting trial. That's a pretty startling statistic for most people to digest.

It's also not lost on me that JPs and judges are commenting on the deplorable conditions of said detention facilities as a disincentive for them to deny bail and keep people housed. That's very important to underscore.

[Tako Van Popta, Conservative, Langley—Aldergrove, BC]

Yes, we heard that from you recently. You're trying to shift the focus to the provinces, which should be doing their part in shared jurisdiction under criminal law, yet Bill C-75 is a federal law that focuses on the principle of least restraint possible. That's your law.

We hear so many people expressing concern—police authorities and premiers—and saying that more needs to be done when it comes to bail reform. Is the concern, perhaps, that stricter bail conditions may be challenged as unconstitutional? In our environment today, repeat violent crime is becoming a scourge in society. Doesn't this pass the Oakes test under section 1 and is an immediate problem that needs to be addressed? Stricter bail conditions could pass a constitutional test such as that.

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

We imposed stricter bail conditions through Bill C-48, which is important. That dealt with seriously violent, repeat offenders. Whether it's being applied and implemented in an appropriate manner by justices of the peace, who do not require any legal training in the province of Ontario, is a question that I think every Canadian should be asking, particularly every Ontarian.

I'm glad you brought up the Constitution, Mr. Van Popta. I don't think it helps to support Canadians' confidence in our institutions, the judiciary or our legal system when the response to this need for investment is simply to say that we should contemplate invoking the notwithstanding clause to override charter rights. That's exactly what has come out of the mouth of your leader, unfortunately. That, to me, is problematic for somebody who professes to be establishing freedoms, as opposed to overriding freedoms.

[Tako Van Popta, Conservative, Langley—Aldergrove, BC]

I'm sorry. You're trying to put words in my mouth. I'm not talking about a notwithstanding clause. I'm talking about laws passing section 1 and the Oakes test as constitutional.

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

I'm not trying to put words in your mouth. It's unfortunately your leader putting those words in his own mouth.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

Thanks to both of you.

Ms. Brière, the floor is yours for five minutes.

[Élisabeth Brière, Liberal, Sherbrooke, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you for being with us this afternoon, Minister.

This Friday, December 6, we are sadly going to mark the 35th anniversary of the tragic anti-feminist attack that occurred at the École polytechnique. Still today we see many violent crimes that target women. It seems that all parties want to support the victims.

In your departmental plan, you state that the safety of Canadians in our communities and online is a priority. First, what are you doing to protect women, including from sexual harassment in the workplace?

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

We have already done a number of things. As I said, in the 43rd Parliament, we passed Bill C‑3, which requires that new judges receive training on sexual assault. In the current Parliament, we have also passed Bill S-12; that bill restored the National Sex Offender Registry, which focuses particularly on predators who attack women.

We have also twice made changes to bail. This affects victims of intimate partner violence. It involves Bill C-75, which was passed in an earlier Parliament, and Bill C-48, which was passed during the current Parliament. So we have done a number of things.

What bothers me a bit, and concerns me, is that on the provinces' part, we see situations where victims of sexual harassment or sexual assault are not able to be heard by a judge and argue their case, to make the accused answer for their acts, because the provinces are not investing enough money, and this results in unreasonable delays. A number of articles have been written recently about the problem in this regard in Ontario.

[Élisabeth Brière, Liberal, Sherbrooke, QC]

Thank you.

You are asking for $4.9 million to support victims and survivors of hate crimes. How would that money be used?

Bill C‑63 will be considered by the committee soon. What are the other measures you have taken to combat the increase in hate crimes? You have mentioned several.

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

Thank you for your question.

The interesting thing about Bill C‑63 is that it addresses the idea of deepfakes, a term used for the first time in the law. It addresses not only revenge porn, the disclosure of images showing intimate relations without consent, but also communicating images of women created entirely artificially. Whether it is really the woman who appears in the image or it is a faked representation of her, the result is the same: the woman is being punished, isolated and frightened, particularly on social media.

That is why this bill is so important. It is not just for adult women; it is also for young teens. We have repeatedly seen how they are victims of attacks by predators. I am thinking of Rehtaeh Parsons and Amanda Todd, and of young boys. These young teens do not have the capacity or tools they need to fight back against predators, and sometimes the result is that they commit suicide, which is a tragedy.

That is why Bill C‑63 is so strong and so necessary if we want to make progress in the fight against predators. This is also about saving our young people, our teens and our women.

[Élisabeth Brière, Liberal, Sherbrooke, QC]

Thank you.

I am going to move on to another subject of considerable concern to us: access to justice. Federal Court Justice Henry Brown said in February 2024 that there is a shortage of judges. Earlier, in your opening remarks, you said that more than 96% of judicial positions had been filled. You have appointed a lot of judges. Where do we stand now?

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

The target set by Justice Brown was about 40. The number of vacant positions in Canada as a whole now stands at about 30.

I appointed 137 judges during my first 12 months in office, when the record was 109 up to then, so I beat that record by about 30 appointments. As well, I am continuing to make appointments quickly and I will keep doing so, because it is absolutely necessary that we be able to fill all the vacant positions if we want all Canadians to have access to justice.

I think it is interesting that the articles critical of the situation of victims of sexual assaults that occur in Ontario do not talk about the superior courts, which are under federal jurisdiction; they all talk about the Ontario Court of Justice, a provincial court, and how the process can be accelerated at that level.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

Mr. Fortin, the floor is yours for two and a half minutes.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Minister, since I do not have a lot of time, I would like you to answer my question quickly.

This morning, I saw in the media that the name of a terrorist entity, the Houthi group Ansarallah, will be added to the list of terrorist entitles. My impression is that that this decision was made because this is considered to be a useful way to combat terrorism.

Last week, I introduced a bill to create an organized crime registry. Do you think it is a good idea to have a registry of criminal organizations as we do for terrorist organizations?

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

Your suggestion is interesting, Mr. Fortin.

I want to note that we are working diligently on the list of terrorist organizations, because our international partners, for example, also have a role to play there.

We will have to take time to consider your idea. I am not certain whether we can do the same thing at the national level for organized crime, but certainly it is a good idea to look at. I agree with you that organized crime is on the rise in Canada and we have to find more ways to combat this scourge.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Do you not believe that the registry would be a valuable tool? If this kind of registry works for terrorism, it could work for organized crime.

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

I would just like to know, from my G7 colleagues, whether that kind of registry exists.

[Rhéal Fortin, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

Right, but in any event, we are talking just about Canada. We are not talking about other countries.

I want to come back to another question before you leave the meeting. I have a few seconds left.

You speak a lot about your track record for appointing judges, which you say is impressive. I have a lot of respect for you, as you know, but former minister Jody Wilson-Raybould had you beat hands down when it comes to times. During her term in office, it took 126 days on average to appoint judges to the Federal Court of Appeal. Since you took office, it has taken 283 days on average. At the Federal Court, her average time to appointment was 476 days, while yours is 786 days. At the Quebec Court of Appeal, her average was 163 days. Yours is 286 days. At the Quebec Superior Court, her average was 158 days, but yours is 185 days.

In some cases, the average time to appointment has practically doubled. Can you explain why there is such a big difference between what Jody Wilson-Raybould did and what you are able to do?

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

Answer very quickly, Minister. I know it is not easy.

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

I would recall that Jody Wilson-Raybould comes from British Columbia. Last week, there was a position vacant on the British Columbia Supreme Court for about 36 hours. The position became vacant on November 26 and I filled it on November 28. So I am doing my best and I will continue to do so.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lena Metlege Diab]

Thank you.

For the final two-and-a-half-minute round, we have Mr. MacGregor.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Minister, in the estimates, you announced that one of the votes is $3 million for funding for the tenant protection fund. Then, under the Canadian Human Rights Commission, the total voted—$1,158,000—is all going to the federal housing advocate.

You know that my colleague MP Zarrillo has been bringing up the issue that some large corporate landlords—Dream Unlimited, in this case—have admitted to using AI software, which the American government alleges can be used by landlords to collude and coordinate on rent increases. This is, as I think most Canadians would agree, a very unfair business practice. It might even be illegal.

With all of the pressures that tenants are facing these days from the organized might of corporate landlords, do you feel that the $3 million in the supplementary estimates to protect tenants and the $1.158 million for the federal housing advocate are adequate amounts of money to effectively address the problems and challenges that Canada's tenants are facing from coast to coast to coast?

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

I'll speak to you as a guy who used to work at a few legal clinics.

It's important when you establish a tenant protection fund that it's funded sufficiently to give people the legal assistance they need. I would just underscore, Mr. MacGregor, that it's $3 million this year. It's a $15-million fund. Could more be dedicated? Absolutely, more could be dedicated. In cities like mine, there is an intense commercialization of rental properties, and it's having detrimental impacts, which include renovictions. By increasing the supply of rental units, you're giving these people more options so that they're not effectively held hostage by predatory corporate landlords.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

I just want to be clear from the outset. I do understand how separate your role has to be from any criminal prosecutions, but can I ask you, in a very broad manner, what interest is the Department of Justice taking in these issues that tenants are bringing up, especially if big corporate landlords are starting to collude using this AI technology?

[Arif Virani, Liberal, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

Our interest is in distributing the funds that will support and finance tenant advocates. Obviously, when it comes to a prosecution or potential prosecution, it is handled by people who are independent from me, as they need to be. It's the PPSC at the national level, and then, obviously, at the provincial level, provincial Crowns in Ontario or B.C. as the case may be.