Evidence of meeting #22 for Justice and Human Rights in the 45th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was c-16.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Wade Chang Liberal Burnaby Central, BC
Thank you.
What changes, whether in law enforcement, social services or community awareness, do you think are most urgently needed to protect those who have companion animals or pets?
Manager, Justice and Legislative Affairs, Humane Canada
I think all three of those could use training on how animal abuse manifests in relationship violence. It's not always physical. There's the emotional abuse of threats to the animal. There's financial abuse, where you're not allowed to take the animal to the vet or feed it, in some cases. There's also technologically facilitated abuse, where trackers are put on leashes.
Training on what constitutes animal abuse in that particular situation is desperately needed at all levels—law enforcement, community services and justice stakeholders.
Liberal
Wade Chang Liberal Burnaby Central, BC
Thank you very much.
I will turn to Ms. Law.
The bill proposes treating certain killings of women as first-degree murder under the concept of femicide. Do you believe this legal recognition will have practical effects on prevention or accountability?
Executive Director, Rise Women's Legal Centre
Thank you, Mr. Chang.
Our organization does not provide criminal law services, so unfortunately I won't be able to speak to your question.
Liberal
Wade Chang Liberal Burnaby Central, BC
Okay.
Bill C-16 introduces new offences targeting coercive and controlling behaviour in intimate relationships. In your experience, how important is this change for survivors who often face non-physical forms of abuse?
Executive Director, Rise Women's Legal Centre
In my experience and that of the organization, I will echo Ms. Kim's and Ms. Silverstone's comments from the earlier panel.
There have been anti-violence experts who have identified the difficulties of survivors accessing this protection under the Criminal Code. We currently have other Criminal Code offences that could protect survivors. We know that intimate partner violence and sexual assault are two of the most under-reported crimes, and I don't think the creation of this coercive control criminal offence will change that.
Liberal
Wade Chang Liberal Burnaby Central, BC
How do you assess the potential for Bill C-16 to meaningfully improve safety and access to justice for survivors of gender-based or intimate partner violence?
Executive Director, Rise Women's Legal Centre
As I said in my opening remarks, and to echo what Ms. Thomson said, I think the best way to move forward and to provide protection is education for all legal system actors so that they understand what intimate partner violence is and so that police officers, Crown prosecutors and judges can move forward and afford the necessary protection to survivors and victims.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
Thank you, Mr. Chang.
It's over to you, Mr. Fortin, for the last five-minute round.
Bloc
Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mr. Stamatakis, I would like to hear the police perspective. Bill C‑16 proposes to combat intimate partner violence, including coercive control. We want to and must fight this scourge. However, I would like your opinion on whether it's appropriate to do the same for seniors.
In your experience, are police officers often called upon to respond to situations involving the coercive control of seniors at the hands of their children, neighbours or other relatives?
President, Canadian Police Association
Yes, it's a very common occurrence that police often get called to respond to. It's challenging. I've heard witnesses give previous testimony around that. Often, it's a child or it's a caregiver. The senior person perhaps has some challenges in terms of communicating what's been happening.
It is a significant challenge. If there was specific legislation around that, specifically on the issue of seniors who are victimized in this way, I think it would be helpful.
Bloc
Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC
At the Canadian Police Association, do you have any statistics on the number of responses required for similar cases involving seniors?
President, Canadian Police Association
I don't have statistics with me at the moment. We will have statistics about those types of calls, so I can get you that information.
Bloc
Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC
I would be grateful, Mr. Stamatakis. You can send them to the clerk, with whom you have been in contact up to now. He'll forward them to us.
I would also like to talk about mandatory minimum sentences. We know that this has been an ongoing debate in the House for many years. In any case, we've been talking about it for the entire 10 years that I've been here. I'm sure that people were talking about it before too.
On the one hand, we would like to see more mandatory minimum sentences. On the other hand, we don't think that they're necessary or useful. In between, we have the Supreme Court, which has struck down many of these sentences. Bill C‑16 proposes to “rehabilitate” certain mandatory minimum sentences by allowing the court to waive them if, in the circumstances of the case under consideration, they would amount to cruel and unusual punishment. I would like to hear your views on this.
First, do mandatory minimum sentences act as a deterrent? Do they help your members do their job?
Second, in your opinion, are the exceptions granted to waive these sentences in specific cases a good thing?
President, Canadian Police Association
I think mandatory minimum sentencing is an important subject. It has been the subject of much conversation. I've been involved in that conversation over many years while in this role.
Look, sentencing people appropriately when they commit offences is an important tool in terms of either deterring those very people from recommitting offences or deterring other people from committing those offences. At the very least, it does help us from a frontline policing perspective, because it takes that offender away from the community where they're causing harm and puts them into an institution for a period of time. The challenge is that we need to build more capacity in our institutions in terms of housing people and in terms of whether we're getting to the underlying issues. If all we do is sentence people to jail without getting to those underlying issues that drive the offences, we're not going to get to better outcomes, ultimately.
Bloc
Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC
Thank you, Mr. Stamatakis.
On the same topic of mandatory minimum sentences, another line of thinking holds that this issue affects marginalized communities in particular. We hear a great deal about the Black and indigenous communities, for example. I would like to hear your views on this.
Is there indeed cause for concern regarding mandatory minimum sentencing for these specific communities, or is it a non‑issue?
President, Canadian Police Association
I think it's a complex problem. It's a problem that requires a lot of context. Again, instead of focusing on the outcomes, which can often be the arrest or the incarceration of somebody from a marginalized or vulnerable community, how about looking at why those people are finding themselves in circumstances where they're having these interactions with the police? We need to look at that more carefully and do more about that.
Bloc
Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC
I'm glad to hear it. That's what I thought. I would have liked to go further, but perhaps we'll come back to this.
Thank you.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal James Maloney
Thank you, Mr. Fortin.
Thank you to our witnesses. We appreciate the time. Unfortunately, we were called away to go and vote, but we got your evidence in and we got one round of questions in, so we're very, very grateful.
Thanks, everybody.
The meeting is adjourned.