National Defence Committee on March 30th, 2010

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

I don't think we're achieving that, for example, out of Gander for east coast responses either.

[Col Paul Drover]

Achieving what, sir?

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

The two hours.

[Col Paul Drover]

To go out to anywhere in the region?

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

To be there, yes.

[Col Paul Drover]

No, and I don't think we can guarantee a two-hour response by aircraft to anywhere in the region. There's not an aircraft that can go fast enough.

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

So we don't have any standard of that nature.

In fact, the Chief Review Staff report of 2008 I referred to complains, in a summary of the main findings:

The CF does not have operational-level doctrine for SAR in place; however, development of Air Force operational SAR doctrine is planned for 2008. In lieu, the National SAR Manual (NSM) is being used as guidance until it will be replaced by the International Aeronautical and Maritime Search and Rescue Manual Volume IV.

Can you tell me whether we now have doctrine in place for SAR?

[Col Paul Drover]

We are currently still using the national search and rescue manual. It is in a different format from the volume 4 supplementary Canadian one referred to, which I understand is being developed. It's not something I'm particularly involved in. It really speaks to the same elements that are in the search and rescue manual.

So if you take the search and rescue manual--I believe you have a copy from our previous occasion--it is basically doctrinal in nature, because it describes from the policy to the tactical.

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

So even though this report is two years old, it's still current. In other words, we don't have one yet. Am I right?

[Col Paul Drover]

Yes, sir.

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

It also complains that there's a difficulty in analyzing a performance because the data is not available for two or three years. On page 11, for example, it talks about readiness and response. It says:

Aside from the preparation of forces and the immediate response there has been little focus on performance measurement beyond annual business plans. This has been hindered by the lack of the Air Force's identification of strategic-level performance measurement information requirements and the absence of a high-level National Standard of Service for SAR. While there are periodic reviews of a specific topic, such as the 2005 Operational Research Division (ORD) basing study, these studies cannot rely on the support of current SISAR data for their analysis as it is normally two to three years out of date.

In fact, in this report they complained that no information was available beyond 2004, and this was January 2008. Has that been fixed?

[The Chair, Conservative, Maxime Bernier]

You have 30 seconds, Colonel.

[Col Paul Drover]

Sir, I'd like to report it has. We're working toward a solution. The difficulty is that we've been using two different databases, and we haven't been rigorous enough in terms of what we're trying to capture. The databases that are currently out there are incomplete in terms of doing the proper performance analysis, and that's an ongoing project right now.

[The Chair, Conservative, Maxime Bernier]

Thank you.

Now we'll give our last member, Mr. Hawn, five minutes.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Again, I have a number of fairly short things.

To refer to some things that were said before, I would like to refer Mr. Simms to a question I asked the last time we spoke. Are we continuing to adapt to changes in traffic as they occur and as we expect them to be in the future? At the risk of using a hockey analogy, to be where the puck is going....

[Col Paul Drover]

We are indeed. Again, every time we have year review we look at the program and the past review, and we do our SAR reporting figuring out if there's a need for improvements and change. I would say we were very responsive to ongoing things. Again, I think participation in the Arctic SAR task force is a good example. We're looking in the Arctic in this case where internationally there is need, or certainly the discussion needs to take place.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

So we're looking at where the puck is going to be.

In your professional opinion, and I know you have decades of experience in SAR, is the SAR manual adequate and effective as a doctrinal manual?

[Col Paul Drover]

In my estimation, what we'll see in the next version is very little change. The format will be changed, but the content won't because basically it's been developed over many years; it's a reflection of what we were dealing with as a very mature program that's been put in place and created to provide that sort of service to the population of Canada. I think it does it very well.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

With your experience with organizations in the military, like the Chief Review Services, are we really just talking about renumbering the paragraphs and putting a different cover on the book?

[Col Paul Drover]

It may be down to that.

If I may take this opportunity, that same report that made those observations made another observation. It said that:

The management and delivery of search and rescue (SAR) services by the Department of National Defence (DND) and the Canadian Forces (CF) is effective and, overall, the Canadian structure and capability are considered as a model internationally.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Thank you.

We talk about lessons learned, data and so on. You addressed that a little bit, but any time there's any kind of an indication that something may have not worked 100%, do we sit down with everybody involved and do a lessons learned? Has that been injected into the process for improvement?

[Col Paul Drover]

Yes, absolutely that takes place. That's one of the responsibilities. Again, the focal point of SAR response really is the rescue coordinating centres. The OIC of that centre, the officer in charge, has a daily review of all case activity. There may be a number going on at any particular time, but if any have special interest it's up to him or her to take those next steps to be able to capture what took place. If need be, as we mentioned earlier, the SAR report, which is a more formal investigation, may be warranted, in which case it will take place. If not, for each SAR aircraft, at the completion of a mission, the aircraft commander will write a SAR report, a trip report. There's documentation throughout the incident from various perspectives, and that's all put together, as required, when warranted.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

In your professional experience, is that an effective process?

[Col Paul Drover]

It is, and it is a trigger as well--an alarm, if you will--to situations that may be deemed unsafe or ineffective for other reasons. At the same time, it serves to highlight some of the finer moments. As you know, our SAR techs in particular do some incredible work, often at great risk to their own lives, and they get recognition through awards for bravery and the like. It is that reporting mechanism and review of cases that bring those forward. That is important to note as well.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Maybe that's a good thing to end with. The SAR techs and people involved in search and rescue get more recognition per person than anybody else in the Canadian Forces. I know everybody would speak with the same voice to thank you and to thank those men and women who do such absolutely incredible work.

I will just point out that we talked about all our aircraft being used from time to time. You may not recall, but we have even used CF-18s out of Bagotville in SAR from time to time. It is a total team.