Evidence of meeting #5 for National Defence in the 42nd Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was threat.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Jean Rioux Liberal Saint-Jean, QC
I am talking about reciprocity and not the number of officers. American officers are posted to the Canadian Forces, as are the 700 Canadian officers in the United States.
Assistant Chief of Defence Intelligence, Canadian Forces Intelligence Command, Department of National Defence
The number is not the same.
Liberal
RAdm Scott Bishop
Yes, there is reciprocity. There are Americans in Canada who work with Canadian Forces on a daily basis. That aspect of our relationship is very important.
Liberal
Conservative
James Bezan Conservative Selkirk—Interlake—Eastman, MB
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I want to thank our witnesses for coming.
Some of the conversation we've had so far is about the aerial defence of Canadian airspace in the NORAD context. The concern I'm hearing from some members is about protecting that western flank, if you want to say.
Canada makes use of other aerial assets than just fighter jets to do surveillance and monitoring. Could you comment on that?
RAdm Scott Bishop
It's very good observation.
We obviously have the fighter jets that play an important role in NATO, and the tankers, as we've talked about, for providing air-to-air refuelling, given the distances that are involved. We also make use of our other air resources in the Canadian Forces to conduct surveillance operations. We have maritime patrol aircraft, which regularly conduct surveillance missions over the approaches to the eastern and western seaboards of Canada.
We have missions that go up into the Canadian Arctic to survey the Arctic land mass, but also the seaward approaches and the waters in the Arctic archipelago. We also work with other government departments that contract aircraft to conduct surveillance and patrol missions. We pair up with them and make use of those aircraft to conduct surveillance.
As I said, we have, again with our partnership with the United States.... One of our strengths in Canada is our expertise in space. We make use of space extensively to assist in the surveillance, particularly on the maritime side of who is in our waters. The navy, on the Atlantic and Pacific approaches to Canada, has a very good picture of what we call marine domain awareness. That has a high level of fidelity, in terms of what ships are in our waters and where they're going.
It's a difficult challenge based on the size of the space that we have to look at, but we do harness all of our resources, and we work with all of our partner agencies in government to maximize the resources they're employing to build the very best picture of what's going on around our territory.
Assistant Chief of Defence Intelligence, Canadian Forces Intelligence Command, Department of National Defence
If I may, this is fundamentally a question of intelligence, right? It's the ability to plug into a global information architecture—signals intelligence, imagery intelligence, human intelligence—to queue those assets, to be where they need to be to find the specific thing we're looking for.
Fundamentally, the job of my organization is to set that framework so that operators and policy-makers can decide where they want to deploy the limited number of assets.
Conservative
James Bezan Conservative Selkirk—Interlake—Eastman, MB
One thing I'm concerned about with the testimony that all of you gave today was the rather dismissive comments about Russia's military threat to Canadian airspace, Canadian sovereignty. We know that the last time we did this study with the committee a few years back that Russian Bear bombers had come within 80 miles of St. John's, Newfoundland, within 40 miles of San Diego. We're constantly scrambling fighter jets to intercept Russian Bears in the Arctic. That frequency has increased since 2009.
We also know that Russia has developed a new navy base in the Arctic. They've opened up six old air force bases and are building an army base in the far north, close to the same latitude as Resolute Bay and Alert. They definitely see the Arctic as something that they are going to protect. They have the new Balaklava submarines with cruise missile capability, with nuclear warheads. We have seen those cruise missiles in operation in Syria just in the last few months.
I hope that your departments are taking the Russian threat seriously. Otherwise, why are we in the Ukraine training Ukrainian forces? Why do we have forces sitting in Poland right now as part of NATO Operation Reassurance? It's because we see Russia as a threat to global security, as well as a threat to Canadian sovereignty.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Stephen Fuhr
That was a long question, so I will have to ask for a quick answer on that one. We can circle back to it.
Assistant Chief of Defence Intelligence, Canadian Forces Intelligence Command, Department of National Defence
Sure.
Very quickly, I can assure you that Russia is at the top of our list in terms of countries we watch carefully and monitor closely. They're certainly taking any number of actions within the Arctic sphere. Of course, they are an Arctic nation, so some of those are to secure their own domestic interests. It is a country that we encounter not just in the Arctic but in many regions of the world where we are trying to achieve effects, and they are often not working in quite the same direction we are.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Stephen Fuhr
We'll have to leave it there. We can circle back after a little bit. There will be some more time.
Mr. Bittle, you have five minutes for your questions, please.
Liberal
Chris Bittle Liberal St. Catharines, ON
Thank you.
We discussed the importance of tankers in defending Canadian airspace. Are tankers compatible with potential replacement fighter aircraft for the CF-18?
RAdm Scott Bishop
That's a good question. I would say that whatever aircraft we acquire will be compatible with the tanker. That would be something they would look at in future fighter replacement. It would obviously be a key requirement of whatever fighter aircraft we look at, or they would incorporate the decision and space to reconfigure the tankers we have if the fighter aircraft needed a different configuration.
Liberal
Chris Bittle Liberal St. Catharines, ON
My understanding is that the F-35 isn't compatible. Is it a difficult process to retrofit our tankers to make them compatible with the F-35?
RAdm Scott Bishop
I think we'll have to get back to you on that. It's a very technical question.
I'm desperately looking around for someone in a light blue uniform to help me out.
RAdm Scott Bishop
On that level of technicality, I would have to go to the air force and get the answer for you.
Liberal
Chris Bittle Liberal St. Catharines, ON
Okay. Much appreciated.
I'll switch gears significantly. You mentioned global climate change. Can you discuss the potential impact to North American security?
Assistant Chief of Defence Intelligence, Canadian Forces Intelligence Command, Department of National Defence
Yes, I can start off on that.
The major impact in terms of North American security is obviously in the north. This actually ties in nicely with the previous question. As polar ice melts and northern routes become more viable economically, we are seeing a large number of countries, particularly some Asian countries, with a great deal of interest in figuring out what their economic stakes might be within the north. China, South Korea, the Japanese, and others are becoming more interested in things like the Arctic Council. Again, it's not a threat, but something from a sovereignty perspective that has to be monitored.
In the Arctic context, the routes that will open first, however, are actually the ones within Russian waters. I think that's why we're seeing a lot of their investment in their own infrastructure along those routes, so that they can exert effective control over their own sovereign interests. There are certainly a number of things from a climate change perspective that are affecting Canadian interests, but that's the primary one that we're watching.
RAdm Scott Bishop
You get increased activity in the Arctic, and there are a bunch of issues that Canada could be expected to respond to. Search and rescue is one, or an environmental disaster of some sort. Those will all require the military to help the federal departments that have responsibility or jurisdiction for those issues to get up to and operate in the Arctic. There's an important role for us.
Looking more broadly at climate change, if we believe the climate modelling, there is a potentiality for more severe weather. That could also have an impact on Canada in the form of more hurricanes, more tornados, and those kinds of things. There could be an increased demand signal for the Canadian Forces to assist in natural disasters, potentially, if climate change carries on in a very unfavourable direction over the course of many years.
Assistant Chief of Defence Intelligence, Canadian Forces Intelligence Command, Department of National Defence
At home and abroad.