National Defence Committee on Nov. 20th, 2020

[MGen Dany Fortin]

Madam Chair, very much so. Mindful of the rising numbers of COVID cases in some of the countries in which we operate, we put additional measures in place to protect ourselves and to limit contact. In some of those places, we have curtailed some specific activities over the last months, and we are resuming some of that training at the request of the country in which we work.

[Sven Spengemann, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

Thank you very much.

I wanted to clarify a bit something from our previous session's testimony. I don't know if this is a fair question or a precise enough question, Major-General. Where in the Canadian Forces is the core of pandemic response expertise located organizationally? If there is a core—it may be more decentralized than that—could you give us a very quick overview of where that expertise sits?

[MGen Dany Fortin]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I will defer to Admiral Patterson in a second, to respond more specifically on the medical.

There's no core for the pandemic, except for the medical branch. In the Canadian Armed Forces, we have internalized many of the lessons learned from wave one and we continue to adapt to change. We have forces across the nation that are identified and that are prepared to respond to a wide range of scenarios to include things that are related to the COVID pandemic.

I'll defer to Admiral Patterson, if she has anything to add regarding the medical.

[Sven Spengemann, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

Thank you.

[RAdm Rebecca Patterson]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Again, it's a geographic dispersion of a number of different functions that we provide from health services, and one of the most key components of this is medical advice. While we may be headquartered with the surgeon general here in Ottawa, we have medical advisers across the country advising the leadership in the army, navy and air force to make sure that their forces are protected locally. In addition, of course, we could talk about how we medically resupply or where troops come from. That is a coast-to-coast issue.

[Sven Spengemann, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

That's a very helpful clarification.

Madam Chair, that's just about my time, so thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Karen McCrimmon]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe, go ahead.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

The mission of the Operation IMPACT in Iraq was affected both by the pandemic and by the deteriorating security situation since the assassination of Major General Qassem Soleimani.

Has security improved over the past few months?

[MGen Dany Fortin]

Thank you for the question.

Concerning Operation IMPACT, especially our activities in Iraq, owing to a change in geopolitical dynamics and a growing threat over the past few months, our forces have been reduced for protection reasons, but also because of a decline in the Iraqi security forces' training activities.

Certain activities are being taken up again. Most activities of the Combined Joint Task Force of Operation INHERENT RESOLVE, or CJTF-OIR, and of the NATO mission in Iraq, which we are commanding for a few days, are mainly focused on training related to the institutional reform of security.

The strategic environment in Iraq being a bit more complex, I cannot give you a full answer on that, but this gives you some indication of the scope of our activities.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Has the health situation over there improved or is it getting worse?

[MGen Dany Fortin]

I could talk about the health situation over there in a general sense, but I would prefer not to say too much right now. We are taking note of the question and will get back to you with a more detailed answer.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Okay.

I have another brief question. Given the telework and the cancellation of many exercises, are you worried about a drop in motivation among the troops, which could impact staff retention?

[MGen Dany Fortin]

Commanders on the ground would be better able to answer your question, especially Brigadier-General Mialkowski and Brigadier-General Carpentier, in that order, if that's okay with you.

I will turn to Brigadier-General Mialkowski.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Okay.

[BGen Conrad Mialkowski]

In terms of what is occurring in Ontario, and my colleague from the province of Quebec can respond shortly afterwards, we're in the high readiness mode. As a second wave of deployments must occur in the spring, we have conducted all of the live-fire requirements that are typical of international deployments. I can assure you, having observed it myself, that there's been no diminishment in either the effectiveness or the activities of that training.

Certainly we have been very scrupulous in ensuring there has been no additional risk added to the training, and we apply force health protection measures throughout that training.

Perhaps Brigadier General Carpentier could speak to the training that he is conducting with his team as they get ready to take that on this summer.

[BGen Gervais Carpentier, Commander 2nd Division and Joint Task Force (East), Department of National Defence]

Good afternoon, Madam Chair.

I thank Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe for the question.

Owing to the current pandemic, we have had to adapt our ways of conducting operations and training. Our approach is more local. There is collective training and mandated training that could sometimes take place outside the province—in our situation, outside Valcartier—but we have concentrated the bulk of our operations in Valcartier.

By taking those steps, we can reach the set objectives in training and education in order to be ready for 2nd Canadian Division's next high operational availability cycle of as of next summer. To answer the question, I would say that we are maintaining a good number of activities, while obviously respecting the health protection measures implemented by the Canadian Forces.

[The Chair, Liberal, Karen McCrimmon]

Thank you very much.

Go ahead, Mr. Garrison.

[Randall Garrison, NDP, Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I want to return to the question of the threat that I believe the high levels of private contracting out present to the Canadian Forces during COVID.

Just to give an idea of why I'm so concerned—

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

I have a point of order, Madam Chair.

We've lost the French interpretation.

[The Chair, Liberal, Karen McCrimmon]

Can we try again, Mr. Garrison?

[Randall Garrison, NDP, Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC]

I want to return to the question of the threat to the health and safety of the Canadian Forces presented by high levels of contracting out. I don't think that most people would be aware that the value of contracts for contracted out personnel represents about a third of the total budget of the Canadian Forces, both those in the Canadian Forces and DND personnel costs, so about a third of all personnel are operating under these contracts.

In October 2020, the Public Service Alliance of Canada published a report called “In the interest of safety and security”. On pages 24 and 25 of that report, they report some very disturbing things happening during COVID. One of those is, of course, the fact that the employees of private contractors often have no sick leave or inadequate sick leave provisions, which force them into the choice of working either immune-compromised when they should be in isolation, or not being able to buy food and pay rent.

The second concern they raise is that they were contacted as a union by employees of private contractors who told them that they were instructed not to raise health concerns directly with DND, that they had to go through the contractor. The the allegation is that those health concerns were not being passed on to DND.

Are measures being taken to make sure that we do not have people who are sick working under those private contracts? Secondly, are health concerns raised by those workers being effectively communicated to DND and the Canadian Armed Forces?

[MGen Dany Fortin]

If you allow me, we'll take this on notice, because it requires a more fulsome answer. I would tell you that I have the privilege of being part of the executive committee on health and security in the workplace oversight committee. While there are discussions about more generic things, there are rich discussions about the importance of ensuring that our personnel—those who are contracted as well as those in the different unions represented at the board, as well as the leadership—are looked after, because we care for their well-being.

We'll take this question on notice, if we may, and provide a more fulsome written answer.

[The Chair, Liberal, Karen McCrimmon]

All right. Thank you very much.

Mr. Dowdall.

[Terry Dowdall, Conservative, Simcoe—Grey, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I want to take an opportunity as well to thank all of the witnesses who are here today and all of the men and women of our Canadian Armed Forces for all that they do for safety and security, not only here but abroad as well. Thank you very much for being here.

We understand that the Department of National Defence and the Canadian Armed Forces are preparing for a request from the government to distribute vaccines across the country. Is the Canadian Armed Forces preparing for a front-facing role, working alongside public health, to distribute the vaccines directly to Canadians and even perhaps administer them in areas with a shortage of front-line health workers?

[MGen Dany Fortin]

It's clear that since the beginning of the COVID-19 pandemic the Canadian Armed Forces have been working in close co-operation with our federal and provincial and territorial partners. We've also been working very closely with the Public Health Agency of Canada. This is why we currently have Canadian Armed Forces personnel in support of the Public Health Agency, specifically in the coordination of the national COVID-19 vaccine strategy. That includes logistics experts as well as other advisers to help as we bring an additional workforce to the problem.

We're very much in the planning phase still, which is essential to a well-coordinated federal response. The items in the—