National Defence Committee on Oct. 18th, 2022

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

You still have a minute left.

[Jennifer O'Connell, Liberal, Pickering—Uxbridge, ON]

Can I take it?

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Yes.

[Jennifer O'Connell, Liberal, Pickering—Uxbridge, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you for coming as well.

I also had questions about drones, so I guess great minds think alike.

On that, my question is more general around the capabilities and the preparedness for the constant evolution of the nature of combat, war or security. When we look at our briefing note from the Library of Parliament about how NORAD began, we see that drones are a perfect example of the ever-changing face of combat and how relatively cheap it is now for an adversary to have eyes in the air, essentially. In Russia we're seeing the impacts of some of the usage, as well as actual combat.

What is being done to prepare? We talk about F-35s and all of the big capabilities we need—and we still need them—but are we focused as well, and is there planning on the evolving nature of combat?

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Unfortunately, Mr. Robillard had one minute and not five minutes.

[Jennifer O'Connell, Liberal, Pickering—Uxbridge, ON]

Well, you can think about it, because I will have time at the end.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

You will have time at the end—

[Jennifer O'Connell, Liberal, Pickering—Uxbridge, ON]

We'll start there.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

—and I'm very keen on the answer to that question.

Madame Normandin, you have two and a half minutes.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you.

Arctic offshore patrol ships aren't icebreakers, so my understanding is that their capability may be limited in the winter. Fighter jets, by the way, no longer require winter maintenance, but technicians are desperately needed right now.

I have a rather broad question. If you compare us with our actual and potential enemies that have the ability to carry out operations in all weather conditions, would you say we are more vulnerable in the winter?

[VAdm Angus Topshee]

Things are always difficult in the Arctic in the winter. There's no daylight, it's extremely cold and everything is covered in ice. Clearly, it's tougher to carry out operations in an environment like that. I do think, however, that our capabilities are comparable to those of our enemies. The conditions are the same for everyone, and all of the navy's systems can continue to operate in those conditions.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Even though the conditions are the same for everyone, I'm not convinced that our ability to respond is comparable to that of countries with nuclear submarines and icebreakers, which we don't have. Are we more vulnerable than other countries when it's winter in the Arctic?

[VAdm Angus Topshee]

Thank you for your question.

You don't need a nuclear submarine to respond to another nuclear submarine. The first thing you have to be able to do is detect that nuclear submarine. Then, you have a number of options, including calling in the Royal Canadian Air Force. A number of systems are available, so it really depends on the type of threat.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you very much.

I don't think I have time for any more questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

That was an excellent example from Ms. Normandin.

Madame Mathyssen is next.

[Lindsay Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

I'm hoping the chair lets me get away with this, because it's not exactly about the Arctic, but it is certainly about that sort of future, where we're going and how we're planning.

Lieutenant-General Kenny, you mentioned space and, just like in the Arctic, the commercialization of space and what's going on in terms of our advancement into space. How much attention should the Canadian government and the Canadian military pay, not to militarizing space, obviously, but to monitoring what's going on up there? How much attention is being paid to that, or how much should be?

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

That is pretty relevant of the Arctic, though.

[Lindsay Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

All right. Good. Phew.

[LGen Eric Kenny]

As you describe, space is becoming more congested and more contested, and it's competitive. We need to realize that commercial industry is putting up satellites at a great rate and actually has the capacity to do that. We, as the military, should not be solely focused on doing only our own programs. We need to be partnered with commercial industries, with the Canadian Space Agency and with our allies, who all contribute together.

One of our strengths is the surveillance of space. We have the ability to surveil what is going on within space for debris and then pass that information on to our allies. We're seen as expert in that field.

Going forward, what I'm looking at is additional capability to do that, because satellites have a limited shelf life, and we can't, unfortunately, just switch them out once they're up there without a replacement.

I'm also focused on communications in the high Arctic, which is relevant to this committee, and surveillance from space.

Those are focus areas, some of which are more in a military context, which will help us with maritime domain awareness, both above and below the sea.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Ms. Gallant, you have five minutes.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

We used to receive updates on Russian incursions into our airspace. Are we meeting our response times in scambling jets? Besides Russia, what other countries have flown into or close to our airspace?

[LGen Eric Kenny]

As you described, this is a NORAD mission—aerospace warning, aerospace control and maritime warning. What we have seen since the invasion of Ukraine in particular are fewer incursions by the Russians into our air defence identification zone. That's related, I think, to their focus right now within Ukraine. When that does occur, you will often see NORAD talk about it.

In terms of other countries we have seen, there are none I can mention at this time.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Undoubtedly the Canadian Armed Forces is experiencing another...well, we did have a decade of darkness, and now, if we don't have an election by 2025, it will be a decade of decimation.

[An hon. member]

Oh, oh!

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

What message do you think the shortage crisis sends to our allies? What message do you think this is sending to Russia and China, as they continue to increase their presence in the Arctic?

I don't think this is a laughing matter.