Natural Resources Committee on June 17th, 2008

[Dr. Nigel Lockyer]

It is sales—sales last year.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Okay. What is driving this change, whereby the majority of it is PET-related, here in Canada?

[Dr. Nigel Lockyer]

It's a good question.

PET, if we call it a modality, is a more modern modality. It has better resolution, better precision. It has, I would say, taken off in the cancer world, and it's becoming very popular for cancer screening. It has the potential of new molecules being developed for targeting specific metabolic activity in your body, so it has received a lot of research interest. All of the major medical centres have them now. The growth in the last few years in the U.S. has been very big.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

You said that in Canada there are 10,000 procedures per day?

[Dr. Nigel Lockyer]

Yes. The estimate was that there were about 900 cameras and maybe eight treatments per day per camera, so I was rounding it up for you.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

All right. Do you see a similar trend to this happening in Canada? Is it more expensive?

[Dr. Nigel Lockyer]

For PET to take off, first of all you need access to the isotopes that are made by cyclotrons. So you have to make the investment for cyclotrons, and that's not going to be made in every hospital. Every hospital can afford a SPECT. The SPECT camera is fairly small and fairly straightforward. At the moment, PET hasn't gone into what I would call mass production mode. Cyclotrons are not in mass production, although there are quite a few around the world, as you can see.

Until the market pressure gives you a PET scanner that's cheaper and cyclotrons that are cheaper and easier to handle—you don't need a large technical staff to look after them—that transition will move along, but it's not going to take off. I would have said that if you looked at the field ten years from now it might be very different. That's my guess.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Who are the key players in supplying that equipment? As you say, it's not mass-produced or anything like that. Who are the suppliers?

[Dr. Nigel Lockyer]

There are a number of major companies that make cyclotrons now. IBA is probably the largest company; it's a Belgian company. GE Healthcare makes cyclotrons; there's a Japanese company that makes them; there's a Canadian company that makes cyclotrons in Vancouver, Ebco . So it's a pretty healthy business, I would say. As for PET scanners, there are again a number of companies around the world that make PET scanners too.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

You mentioned ten years. Do you believe the market's going to drive us more toward that kind of technology?

[Dr. Nigel Lockyer]

Yes, I do.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Thank you, Mr. Allen.

Is there anyone else from the Conservative Party?

Okay. We'll go, then, just for a short question, to Ms. Bell, and then to any Liberal who would like ask questions, if there is anyone.

Ms. Bell, go ahead.

[Catherine Bell, NDP, Vancouver Island North, BC]

Thank you.

Just following up on Mr. Allen's line of questioning, which is where I wanted to go, is it wise, then, given the change in technology and the change we're going to see in the future, to be building the old-style reactors, the old technology, and investing all that money, when we can see that the market is changing and the usage is changing?

[Dr. Nigel Lockyer]

I think that may be the question you have to decide. I'm somewhat biased towards PET—I might as well just tell you that—so I think the answer is I that see it as where the field is going. It's a question of how big it becomes and whether it really replaces SPECT, because SPECT, as I said, can be in every hospital. It's in every operating room. It's very prevalent. So the question is, what will be the demand for it?

My suspicion is that it is not a growing demand, that at best it's a flat demand. Then the question will be whether it rolls off. I just don't know enough to be able to answer that question.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Thank you, Ms. Bell.

Are there any further questions?

Seeing none, thank you very much for coming today, Dr. Lockyer. We do appreciate that and the very interesting information you have given us. It will be helpful to us. Thank you very much.

I've been given notice of the motion, which we will get to in a minute, but Mr. Anderson had indicated he has something he'd like to ask the committee about.

[David Anderson, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

Mr. Chair, I talked to some of the committee members, and I think we may have agreement here. I'd like to invite the committee to a reception from 11:30 to 1:00 in my office on Thursday in lieu of a meeting. I talked to the critics. They seemed to be okay with that, so I just wanted to check and make sure the committee was in favour of that. I think we have one witness or whatever, so that would mean cancelling that as well. It is whatever the committee decides here. I think we had some agreement. I just wanted to make sure.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

I will just put it to the committee. Is there agreement to that?

Mr. St. Amand.

[Lloyd St. Amand, Liberal, Brant, ON]

I can't recall the name of the witness or from what distance he or she was coming.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

The one thing about the witness, of course, is it seems somewhat uncertain that the House will be sitting on Thursday, in which case the witness would be cancelled. It may not be as serious a consideration as otherwise might be.

[Lloyd St. Amand, Liberal, Brant, ON]

That may be, but who was the witness?

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Yes, who was the witness?

[The Clerk of the Committee, Mr. Chad Mariage]

Mr. Chair, the witness was Daniel Rozon, from École polytechnique in Montreal. So he's coming from Montreal.

[Lloyd St. Amand, Liberal, Brant, ON]

All right.

[The Chair, Conservative, Leon Benoit]

Madame DeBellefeuille.