Natural Resources Committee on Oct. 27th, 2025

[Michael Gullo]

I think there are some immediate things we could get to you so that you can start to understand some models that are out there.

Infrastructure Australia has a terrific model where they go through the identification of infrastructure assets. The criteria are heavily economics-weighted, so that the decisions around where to put the tax dollars are really being focused on assets that are going to generate a strong economic return for the citizens. There are some models there that we would be happy to point you to.

One of the observations that I shared in my opening remarks was around the idea of creating a critical mineral reserve for our NATO allies. That can't be done in government isolation. That's a table that can be struck immediately between the private sector and government in order to look at the commodities that are essential for national security and the market mechanisms required to unlock the potential of those, and then have the offtake agreements, not only with our own government, but starting to explore what's possible with NATO partners. That's something that can be done in short order.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

You have 30 seconds.

[Mario Simard, Bloc, Jonquière, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I wanted to quickly address this matter, Mr. Gullo. I believe that you're saying that, if we were fortunate enough to hold a critical mineral reserve, mining it would be a good way to get more out of this strategic sector. However, to do so, we need infrastructure. There's actually an excellent project for this in Saguenay—Lac‑Saint‑Jean.

I'll wrap up by saying that we already have the solution, Mr. Gullo.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

Okay. Thank you.

Mr. Martel, you have five minutes, and then Mr. Danko will wrap up with five minutes as well.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My question is for you, Mr. Gullo.

The government doesn't want to withdraw the legislation resulting from Bill C‑69. At least, it insists on keeping the legislation.

Do you believe that Bill C‑5 can speed up the implementation of major projects?

[Michael Gullo]

We do believe in Bill C-5. We have signalled our strong support for the direction it's trying to head in. We appeared in front of the Senate to communicate our support for it.

We think the early signals are positive. The CEO of the MPMO is a person with exceptional characteristics and qualities and very capable of taking on major assignments. I think her track record is quite strong. Some of the other parts of the machinery they've built around it, in order to ensure they're working with the indigenous communities in an appropriate way through the advisory council, are very positive.

We have to have faith in the process, in our view, because we need something to meet the moment. At the same time, we're not in the business of seeing workarounds. That's why some of the arguments I've put forward in front of you today—around where structural reforms could occur in the context of one project, one review and one assessment—really need to be taken into account, because there will be a lot of capital and projects flowing outside of the Bill C-5 structure. That's just as important, and we need to make sure that stands on firm ground.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Do you believe that we can remain competitive without changing a certain part of the regulations and the process for obtaining permits?

[Michael Gullo]

If we didn't make any changes, that would be a serious handicap to our competitive position. In the event that we did nothing, that wouldn't resonate, I don't think, with the private sector. That wouldn't resonate with what Canadians want. Broad strokes of different political parties are all calling for reform, and we do need to meet this moment in that capacity.

We have ideas to share around where regulatory reform can occur within the construct of the impact assessment itself, without having to go through a process where we're repealing a full piece of legislation and then waiting all of that time to replace it with something, which, in parallel, just discourages investment, or at least puts it on ice or on the sidelines, at a moment when we really want to see that capital flow into Canada in the near term.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Could you tell me how many different federal agencies or departments are typically involved in reviewing a single mining project?

[Michael Gullo]

In totality, it would obviously range from project to project, depending on where it—

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Can you tell me how many federal permits a mining developer must obtain?

[Michael Gullo]

We have an example in our report of projects that sometimes have to obtain hundreds of permits.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Mr. Gullo, you spoke about foreign price manipulation. It's quite worrying. We don't seem to have any control over this. When market share is up for grabs, it often affects prices and can also prevent a mine from making a profit.

Is there any way to control this? Are we at the mercy of these price manipulations?

[Michael Gullo]

I certainly think it's a major headwind, but in thinking through our proposal around a critical mineral reserve for Canada, there has certainly been identification of a number of tools that are available, ranging from infrastructure funds to loan guarantees, investment tax incentives, price floors, equity positions and offtake agreements. We have to look at the totality of what's available in order to stand up these projects that are going to harvest the minerals we need for our national security purposes.

Although there are headwinds, we're very hopeful that a solution can be created.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

Thank you.

[Richard Martel, Conservative, Chicoutimi—Le Fjord, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

Mr. Danko, you have five minutes, and then we'll wrap up.

[John-Paul Danko, Liberal, Hamilton West—Ancaster—Dundas, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I am standing between the end of this committee and the craft brewers' reception.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[The Chair, Liberal, Terry Duguid]

We are televised, by the way.

[John-Paul Danko, Liberal, Hamilton West—Ancaster—Dundas, ON]

I have a couple of questions for Mr. Gullo.

The Business Council of Canada relies on the expertise of your members for data-driven policy in order to strengthen Canada's economy, our social fabric and democratic institutions.

I notice that, in your publications, there is a very strong emphasis on climate change, clean growth and low-carbon energy solutions.

I want to give you this opportunity to expand on why Canadian businesses and the Business Council of Canada put such a strong emphasis on climate change, the environment and those kinds of policies.

[Michael Gullo]

First and foremost, we have a great story to tell in terms of the environmental attributes of the vast majority of our natural resources and agricultural products in the country. When we have done our benchmarking, it has shown that Canadian companies are best in class, and that's something we're absolutely proud of.

At the same time, maintaining that best-in-class status is going to require a lot of work, and that's where we start to explore what types of policies we need in order to maintain that edge. Access to abundant clean electricity, for example, is something that has been a hallmark of investment in Canada, but look at where we're at now. Provinces that once had surpluses are now facing deficits, so we need to get on with a pro-electricity agenda in order to maintain this best-in-class status.

That's just one area where we think it's vital for us to stay on top of this. In turn, it attracts investment, and we need a heck of a lot more of it in Canada at the moment.

[John-Paul Danko, Liberal, Hamilton West—Ancaster—Dundas, ON]

Thank you.

Just tying that back to critical minerals and development, in your opening remarks, you specifically noted green energy as driving demand for critical minerals. That's what we've heard from a number of witnesses.

How do you see that from a business perspective as a growth area for Canadians, from extraction to processing to finished products?

[Michael Gullo]

It's certainly being stress-tested right now in a number of different green technology applications, but we have to play the long game on this and realize that critical minerals are really the source of a lot of technologies—advanced technologies, green technologies and defence technologies—so the sooner we can get a stronghold on more market share, the more it will create long-run growth for Canadians, which is a great thing.

[John-Paul Danko, Liberal, Hamilton West—Ancaster—Dundas, ON]

Thank you.

For my final question, I'll turn it over to Mr. Fleming for the last word today.

I'd be interested in hearing the Métis perspective on green energy, environmental policies and regulations and climate change in terms of critical minerals growth and expansion.