Official Languages Committee on May 26th, 2009

[Pierre Daigle]

We sent a letter based on what we saw in February 2008.

[Michael Chong, Conservative, Wellington—Halton Hills, ON]

That's right, so we don't really know that your office hasn't fully assessed what has happened at Borden since August of last year.

[Pierre Daigle]

No, Mr. Chair, and I guess the Canadian Forces can give us a better update as to where they stand on this.

[Michael Chong, Conservative, Wellington—Halton Hills, ON]

Just to be clear, this is the situation as of last summer. It's my hope, and I would expect, that further progress has been made in the last 10 months or so. Perhaps it would be good to hear from the Department of National Defence directly as to the progress, any progress, that's been made in the last 10 months.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

We will, Mr. Chong, on June 9 with Major-General Semianiw and other public servants.

[Michael Chong, Conservative, Wellington—Halton Hills, ON]

Thank you very much for your presentation today.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

We'll continue with Ms. Zarac.

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

Thank you. My question will be brief. Mr. Nadeau mentioned that there was a problem to solve regarding the offer of services, and I believe that's the case. Language courses are definitely offered on military bases. Are those courses mandatory?

[Pierre Daigle]

As regards the Borden base, since students had to wait for their training, we recommended that they be given language courses in the meantime. So there was a possibility of offering language courses at Borden. I believe the results of that request were not very satisfactory: few individuals had access to language courses.

[Denis Egglefield]

Mr. Chairman, there were two mechanisms in place. One was a computer system that was not functional at the time of our audit, and the second consisted in sending people to take courses at places such as Saint-Jean-sur-Richelieu. If I remember the figures correctly, over a three-year period, nine candidates were sent there to take courses.

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

So they're unable to offer courses to people who want to take them. Don't you think that should be mandatory from the outset?

[Pierre Daigle]

I have a memory blank. I know that language courses are offered to military members, but I don't remember at what stage in their career or at what rank those courses are offered. However, there are measures in place within the Canadian Forces to provide language instruction to our military members.

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

In closing, I would like to thank you for making the effort because, as you say, there is injustice. Thank you for giving this matter priority. Moreover, you won't constantly be able to devote your energy to it, so it's important to have a set objective and to determine the results on a given date.

Is that in fact the case? Is there a target date?

[Pierre Daigle]

When we make our recommendations, we normally impose, if I can use the word, a date to review the actions taken. It happens that people ask us for an extension since they have to compile the information, and so on. Normally, however, we set a timetable with deadlines that we follow very closely.

[Lise Zarac, Liberal, LaSalle—Émard, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you, Ms. Zarac.

Mr. Nadeau.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Last year, 28 complaints were sent to the Commissioner of Official Languages concerning National Defence. National Defence was one of the top 10 departments, agencies and crown corporations receiving the most complaints. That's an item of information that was requested a little earlier and that has just come to mind.

I'm the member for Gatineau. I assume your office is in Ottawa or Gatineau.

[MGen Pierre Daigle]

It's in Ottawa.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

I'd be curious to know—without you giving me their names—whether the people in your circle in the National Defence offices are all bilingual. Are there any unilingual francophones or anglophones? And if there aren't any unilingual francophones, are there any unilingual anglophones. You can somewhat see the inequality of the situation. In addition, the vast majority of people who speak English and French are usually people whose first language is French.

I'm asking you the question simply out of curiosity. Do you think there are indeed any unilingual francophones who have as much of a chance as unilingual anglophones of getting positions in the region with the Canadian armed forces? Is any special attention paid to that?

[Pierre Daigle]

Are you talking about my office in particular?

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

I'm talking about your office and in general. You've been in the armed forces for a long time. Are there any unilingual francophones occupying positions in the region?

[Pierre Daigle]

Unfortunately I couldn't tell you. My office offers service in both official languages and takes diversity and bilingualism into account, but it's impossible for me to speak for the Canadian Forces in the National Capital.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

It would be interesting to know whether the offices of the armed forces lead by example.

I assume this is a mandate that you've been given and that your predecessors had for Gagetown, Saint-Jean and Borden. I hope you'll examine the services that are provided to military members across Canada, whether they are members of the air force, army or navy.

Do you intend to conduct a study across the armed forces to determine whether unilingual francophone members, regardless of where they are, have as much of a chance of receiving services in their language as their unilingual anglophone counterparts? Are you going to address that subject?

[Pierre Daigle]

I've examined a number of files since I took up my position, but this one has become a priority. I intend to visit all the Canadian Forces bases, perhaps even outside Canada, and that's definitely an aspect that I'm going to look at more closely, as regards both unilingual francophones and unilingual anglophones. All anglophone and francophone Canadian Forces recruits go through St-Jean, Quebec. Most of those who want to learn a trade in the Canadian Forces, whether they are francophone or anglophone, go through Borden, where the majority of trade schools are located. So the two language groups must receive the same services across the country. That's something I'm going to check on my visits.

[Richard Nadeau, Bloc, Gatineau, QC]

I know that you have held the position of ombudsman for three months. Do you have to make public the reports you regularly submit to the Minister of National Defence and to the person responsible for official languages in the armed forces?