Official Languages Committee on Dec. 1st, 2009

[Monique Guay, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

I don't have a lot of time. I want to know whether you impose fines and how many you have imposed.

[Toby Lennox]

I don't impose any fines because that doesn't work. It's more effective to—

[Monique Guay, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

So you let things go.

How does that work in Vancouver, Mr. Levy?

[Paul Levy]

It's the same thing. We don't give any fines. Ultimately we can cancel the lease, but we're not aware that we've given any fines.

[Monique Guay, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

You've never imposed any fines. However, they have been imposed in Ottawa.

So that means that no one enforces the act because you're afraid of losing your clientele or your franchisees. That makes no sense. The act has been around for 40 years. You are running and trying to plug the holes so you can be sure bilingual services are offered virtually everywhere. It won't work; it will be a failure, and that's what's troubling. That's what scares us here in the committee.

We are concerned about all the groups that we've met to date: VANOC, CATSA and so on. They are unable to provide service in both official languages. You're proving the same thing to us. I hope you make an effort. You don't have a lot of time; you have nine more weeks.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you.

[Monique Guay, Bloc, Rivière-du-Nord, QC]

The image we want to project of Canada should represent what it is, that is to say a bilingual country.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you, Ms. Guay.

We'll continue with Ms. O'Neill-Gordon.

[Tilly O'Neill-Gordon, Conservative, Miramichi, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to all the witnesses for joining us today.

Coming from the bilingual province of Canada, I certainly realize that the retail sector has a problem all the time in trying to obtain bilingual workers. I'm happy to hear about the work you have put in place to try to make things more bilingual and more available for all of us travelling across Canada. I also appreciate hearing Mr. Benoit say that these changes are not just for now, but are planned to be in place permanently.

My question is for Mr. Lennox. I wonder whether you could describe precisely what your airport is doing to serve well the francophones who are travelling through the airport, and I'd like to know whether these measures came into place just because of the 2010 Olympics.

[Toby Lennox]

Thank you.

Let me mention a couple of things about what will be happening at Pearson airport, first of all.

We do 85,000 passengers a day. We anticipate that during the Olympics the level of traffic might go up to about 100,000 a day, which really is not that much for us; it's not that busy a day. In fact, what we are doing is building on our existing programs. As I said, our front line staff are 75% bilingual, so we are making sure that we are redeploying them.

We are taking the opportunity of the Olympic Games to use them as a vehicle to remind people of their French-language obligations under the Official Languages Act. As I said, we are working with the official languages office to tailor the training appropriately.

In fact, in November of last year, they came to us and asked, “What is the best way to approach the government agencies?”. One of the things that is difficult for airport authorities is to go to the government agencies, CATSA and CBSA, to explain to them their obligations, because they already have so many responsibilities to the federal government.

One of the things that I think is important for us—and, please, I don't offer this by way of excuse—is that the issue of official languages shifts, so we need to use every opportunity we can to remind people. In previous years, for example, we had a very virulent complaint from a passenger that we used as the example for our retailers to say, “This is exactly how somebody should not be treated”. Then the staff turns over and we have to do it again.

We would anticipate a staff turnover of between 20% and 30% between now and the time the Olympics happen, so we're tailoring our training. We're also trying to use this as a lever for longer-term sustainable French-language and official-languages programming at Pearson. Will it be difficult? Absolutely. Will it be a challenge? Absolutely.

Will we be 100% perfect and compliant? That's going to be a challenge. All I can give you now is our absolute commitment that we will make the best effort we can and that we'll continue with those efforts.

[Tilly O'Neill-Gordon, Conservative, Miramichi, NB]

I can see that you're doing it. I feel that you are putting forth your best effort in all areas. I'm wondering whether any of these initiatives that you are putting forth are just for the Olympic Games or whether they will be there afterwards.

[Toby Lennox]

As I say, no, because we are not going to be experiencing an increase in staff, we're trying to use this as a means of... It's slightly different, in that I don't have to train staff just for the Olympics. What I have to do is take the staff I have, and the staff that the concessionaires and the front line staff have, and remind them. The one thing we would probably be doing is focusing our attention a little more.

For example, because most people will just be transiting Pearson airport, we're not going to be focusing as much on working with the car rental companies. What we know is that most people will be connecting. We're working with the official languages commissioner's office in Toronto to provide focus training, but then we want to use it to build on, to continue. You're not going to see signs come down afterwards. You're going to see continued diligence to try to ensure that we can fulfill our obligations.

[Tilly O'Neill-Gordon, Conservative, Miramichi, NB]

On the training that's done and made available for the staff, is it convenient for them to take?

[Toby Lennox]

Yes. An airport is a 24-hour place and one of the things we had to work on with the official languages commissioner was where it was most effective to use the training and when you do it. Shifts, as my colleagues will attest, l start at four o'clock or five o'clock in the morning. We try to tailor it to shifts, when we can do it.

As Mr. Benoit has suggested, we're not really in a position to require our front line tenants to go off and do language training for quite a while. They can't do that, so we try to do it in ways such that it can work.

Again, it is a struggle, because we're finding. with the change in population in Toronto. that in the case of most of the people we need or are hiring, their mother tongue isn't English or French. In fact, their secondary tongue may not even be English or French. The first step is to have people trained to recognize French when they hear it.

That is part of the training we're doing to try to tailor it. As I say, the objective here is to make sure that the character of Canada comes out, and we hope we'll be able to do that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Steven Blaney]

Thank you, Ms. O'Neill-Gordon.

We'll now complete our second round with Mr. Godin.

Monsieur Godin.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Mr. Levy was talking about the Internet after a question was raised about it. The information was in one language and they're doing the translation now.

Do you have the same problem in Toronto?

[Toby Lennox]

I'm going to admit something. Our Internet website is pathetic. We are in the process of completely redesigning our website. I make every apology I can, but our website, in many respects—

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Is the problem all in the French? Nothing in the English?

[Toby Lennox]

No, our website isn't... To be quite honest with you, I'm in charge of it, and our website isn't good from the moment you click on to the moment you leave. We are doing a complete rebuild of our website, from the ground up. Unfortunately, that is going to take some time. Quite frankly, I recognize that our website is not good.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Is yours the same problem? Is it all in the French and nothing in the English, Mr. Levy?

[Paul Levy]

It's in English and parts of it are in French. We'll continue to work on it to put more of it in French.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

And you, Mr. Benoit?

[Paul Benoit]

When you go to our site, there are the words “Welcome” and “Bienvenue”. It's 100% English and French.

[Yvon Godin, NDP, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Honestly, with regard to your web site, you have problems and that concerns you. You can come and tell us things about Tim Hortons, but, with regard to the web site, there are no more excuses. Really, we may look like a group of nasty people here this morning, but consider that we are in a bilingual country. We're saying we want to show the entire world that we live in a bilingual country, but we aren't bilingual at all. The act has been violated for 40 years. The FCFA report isn't positive. The Commissioner of Official Languages has been forced to get involved and now we're panicking because of the Olympic Games. I apologize and I don't want to say this in a nasty way, but I really don't care about the Olympic Games. The Official Languages Act has been around for 40 years. You can hire professionals for the web site. You aren't forced to hire newly arrived immigrants who don't speak French. I believe there must be Canadians, among the 33 million people who are able to look at the web site and to ensure that everything is written in both languages. That's where we realize that there is no will. This is insulting. You are subject to the Official Languages Act.

The law of our country is the Official Languages Act, and that problem is as simple as hiring somebody. If somebody goes onto the website, it has to be in both languages. On that one, I'm sorry, there's no excuse.

I was in Vancouver a couple of weeks ago. I went to the information centre and heard, “I'm sorry, but I don't speak French”. That was at the information centre, not Tim Hortons. If there's one place where people learn both languages, it's Vancouver. The Chinese community comes there and wants to learn both languages, and they know more than just saying, “Je m'excuse, je ne parle pas français”.

I want your reaction. Where is the failure here? Because, gentlemen, using something that is not accessible, like the website, so that you cannot do it, what else can you do? I mean, this one here, it just means money: you hire somebody to get it done.

[Toby Lennox]

Maybe I can just clarify this for you. Our website is bilingual. The problem is that our website doesn't actually respond in other ways that we wish it would, so at the present time we're tearing our website down and rebuilding it. Quite frankly, it actually has nothing to do with the Olympic Games. It's something we're rebuilding because we recognize the opportunity to make it right.