Evidence of meeting #110 for Official Languages in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was health.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Jean Rioux  Saint-Jean, Lib.
Denis Simard  President, Assemblée communautaire fransaskoise
Carol-Guillaume Gagné  Chief Executive Officer, Association des parents fransaskois
Mélissa Castonguay Cossette  Administrator, Association des parents fransaskois
Francis Kasongo  Executive Director, Collège Mathieu
Kouame N'Goandi  Manager, Accountability, Conseil économique et coopératif de la Saskatchewan
Alpha Barry  Chair, Conseil des écoles fransaskoises
Anne Leis  President, Réseau santé en français de la Saskatchewan
Ronald Labrecque  Executive Director, Assemblée communautaire fransaskoise
Frédérique Baudemont  Executive Director, Réseau santé en français de la Saskatchewan
Marie-France Kenny  President, Coopérative des publications fransaskoises
Patrick Hopf  President, French-Speaking Jurists Association of Saskatchewan
Karen Pozniak  Executive Director, Saskatchewan, Canadian Parents for French
Céline Moukoumi  President, Communauté des Africains francophones de la Saskatchewan
Gilles Groleau  Chairman of the Board of Directors, Conseil culturel fransaskois
Suzanne Campagne  Director, Conseil culturel fransaskois
Roger Gauthier  Fédération des aînés fransaskois

11:10 a.m.

Chairman of the Board of Directors, Conseil culturel fransaskois

Gilles Groleau

She made some interesting statements. She asked, for example, why anyone would want to go to Saskatchewan, since we are just like Americans. This does not concern only the people of Saskatchewan, but also francophones. For our part, we are here. Obviously, it created a bit of a stir on Radio-Canada and all over the place.

11:10 a.m.

President, Coopérative des publications fransaskoises

Marie-France Kenny

Who is Ms. Brais?

11:10 a.m.

Chairman of the Board of Directors, Conseil culturel fransaskois

Gilles Groleau

She is the wife of Mr. Legault, the leader of the CAQ. I was reflecting on all this and I realized that I still have a lot of work to do and that we are still a long way from our goal.

In my view, bilingualism depends on culture. In fact, I think the very survival of a population depends on culture. Considering the limited resources we have here in Saskatchewan, we are performing miracles, achieving incredible things, but it's all hanging by a thread. We are keeping things afloat, but it's not always easy. The French language needs to be promoted more effectively, more prominently and more actively, and the Official Languages Act needs to be modernized, so that the fransaskois culture can flourish and be showcased more.

Additionally, the act must be more than just a declaration or words written on paper. It must also be binding. For us, enforcing the legislation is key. Having meetings like this one is all well and good. I think it's excellent, but enforcing the law, what happens on the ground, is another matter. Enforcing the Official Languages Act is crucial, especially here, where we are a very small minority. We represent only about 1.8% of the population. That's pretty small, but we are quite strong.

We are a strong and vibrant community, but there are some gaps in our ability to promote our artists. Recently, one of our artists managed to take first place at the Granby International Song Festival. It was the first time in the history of Saskatchewan that one of our francophone artists has won this Quebec competition.

It's huge, but there is still work to be done. We definitely need to promote that artist. The official languages program can help us to some degree, but it must absolutely be modernized in order to be able to meet our artists' needs, whether in music, visual arts or other areas. It's also important that French not be limited to just the federal government; it needs to be recognized all across Canada.

I will now give Ms. Campagne a chance to add her remarks.

11:15 a.m.

Suzanne Campagne Director, Conseil culturel fransaskois

Good morning.

My name is Suzanne Campgagne, and I'm the director of the Conseil culturel fransaskois. I was a performer in Hart Rouge for years. Since I became an administrator in the arts and culture sector, I now have a different perspective.

I can tell you that it was good news for us when we heard that the Official Languages Act was going to be modernized. The Official Languages Act was created during a time when the federal and Quebec governments were clashing, but a lot has changed since then.

In the arts and culture world—and I'll certainly focus on artists and culture in my speech—we truly believe that the act, in its current form, is more about statements than it is about enforcement, as my colleague said. This is a problem for the francophone minority in Canada, and this is why we think that part VII of the act, which deals with enhancing the vitality of francophone minority communities should be the preamble of this modernized act.

We also think that the arts and culture sector should be considered its own sector. We can talk about all of the benefits of bilingual country, but artists and cultural communities essentially embody this success. If we are modernizing the act, we have to look at modernizing the promotion and development of this act, which is currently lacking. The act does not not address promoting a bilingual country, and it is artists and their work who make this happen.

One of Canada's most prolific francophone visual artists, Joe Fafard, is from Saskatchewan, and Lord Byrun, who is also from Saskatchewan, won a 50-year-old competition. Both of of these men are powerful representatives. Of course, we are showing Quebeckers that there are francophones elsewhere, but we are also showing our financial backers that their money delivers real results. This is why I truly believe that arts and culture must play an important role in the modernization of the act.

11:15 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Denis Paradis

Thank you very much, Ms. Campagne. Thank you very much, Mr. Groleau.

We will continue with Marie-France Kenny.

11:15 a.m.

President, Coopérative des publications fransaskoises

Marie-France Kenny

Good morning, Mr. Chair and honourable members.

I sincerely thank you for inviting the Coopérative des publications fransaskoises, which has published the Eau vive newspaper in Saskatchewan since 1971. My name is Marie-France Kenny, and I have been the president of this organization since May 2017.

I also thank you for travelling here. This is the first time you've come to Saskatchewan, a province that is usually forgotten, and you can tell Ms. Brais that you met with members of a strong, vibrant and active fransaskoise community.

I had the opportunity to talk about our newspaper when I testified on March 19, as part of your study on minority community media, so I will not talk too much about the newspaper itself. I will focus on the action plan, as you asked, and on what kind of impact this plan and the investments announced in the government's budget will have. The government also announced investments in media in the budget.

When I met with you in March, the Coopérative had accumulated a deficit of just over $40,000 and had one and a half employees. Since then, the government announced in its budget that it would provide funding to help minority community media, and the action plan came out. The additional funding to help minority community media will certainly help us, as these media are in precarious situations, like we were. This was in the budget, not in the action plan. We will soon be getting $50,000 in assistance. The problem with this investment from the government is that we have been told not to hire staff with this money.

We have one and a half employees, or one full-time and one part-time employee who work between 60 and 80 hours a week. One of them is here this morning. We have been told to use the money to develop new markets, and so on. We need a staff member to do that. I recommend that the government at least set a percentage. I would not mind if the government decided that 30% of the money could be used to hire employees, but the media need to be able to use some of this funding to hire staff.

The action plan investments in the young Canada works program have allowed us to hire an intern, an entry-level journalist, for one year. This is a very important resource. We will be growing to two and a half employees, which is very much needed. Next year, we will be allowed to hire another intern. I'm sure you understand that these interns need orientation, training and supervision. In return, they learn and gain experience so that they can find a full-time job at the end of the year. This means that, at the end of the year, when they've finally found their footing and are starting to understand how things work, we'll have to let them leave and find someone new. We start over from scratch.

As an employer, I assure you that if a year of experience can help them get a job, two years of experience would make it even easier for these journalists to join the workforce. I recommend that the government look at allowing newspapers to decide whether they want to keep the same intern for two years, in order to provide more stability and to give new journalists a two-year internship, which would make it easier for them to get a job afterwards.

I want to take this opportunity to remind you that these long-awaited, much-appreciated investments are absolutely essential to the survival of our newspaper, but they are one-time investments, which do not reverse the damage caused by the cuts to federal advertising we've experienced, which are in violation of the Official Languages Act.

One-time financial assistance is certainly helpful, but the annual shortfall is no different. We are talking about $50,000 a year. An investment of $50,000 this year to help us out of a difficult situation will not be renewed next year. We are talking about $50,000 a year for us, and about $2 million a year for all of our francophone minority newspapers. I urge the new Minister of Canadian Heritage and Multiculturalism, the hon. Pablo Rodriguez, whose mandate is to work with newspapers and manage federal advertising, to right this wrong as soon as possible.

Now, I would like to speak, not as the president of the Coopérative des publications fransaskoises, but as someone who has rather good knowledge of our communities. I have to say that the only part of the action plan I support is the part about the Canadian francophonie. I work with all parties, as long as the work will support the Canadian francophonie.

The action plan reflects the cross-Canada consultations on official languages reasonably well. I say reasonably well, since we were heard, but the investments fall short of the demands and the needs. There were a lot of oversights in Saskatchewan. The topics of women, equality and parity are hot topics now, as are family caregivers, the majority of whom are women, and assistance for seniors, yet the Fédération provinciale des Fransaskoises has not received funding for programming in three years, and its only project was denied.

The Fédération des aînés fransaskois, which submits programming requests, has not received funding for five years because there supposedly is not enough money. This federation has been granted a $30,000 project, but no money for programming. This means that it will not receive the additional 20% that everyone received because it did not have any programming. This may not seem like much, but for an organization that is receiving $30,000, it's a lot.

Since there is more money this year, I recommend that the so-called project granted to the Fédération des aînés fransaskois be converted into programming and that it be granted a substantial increase so that it can develop this programming.

I also recommend that support be given to the Fédération provinciale des Fransaskoises. I'm not necessarily talking about financial support, but the federation doesn't have the material and human resources to submit a detailed programming request for next year.

It takes longer than expected to implement the action plan, and most of our organizations are worried about this. In the past, we sometimes had to wait more than a year for implementation. This meant that we sometimes didn't have access to all of the initiatives and their financing. A lot of time is spent setting the criteria. Once they're set, we're given three months to implement them, but we don't have enough human or financial resources to do so.

The government should not only consult the communities about the criteria, but it should also explain to them how the consultations are factored in. There should be a mid-term evaluation. This was done in the past as part of the roadmap. However, at the time, the evaluations were simply anecdotes. There was no information about where the money had been invested. The money from the last two roadmaps still hasn't been fully invested.

I therefore suggest that at the end, if all of the money announced hasn't been spent, that it be given to all of the organizations according to the formula currently used.

11:20 a.m.

President, Coopérative des publications fransaskoises

Marie-France Kenny

I had the opportunity to talk about our newspaper when I testified on March 19, as part of your study on minority community media, so I will not talk too much about the newspaper itself. I will focus on the action plan, as you asked, and on what kind of impact this plan and the investments announced in the government's budget will have. The government also announced investments in media in the budget.

When I met with you in March, the Coopérative had accumulated a deficit of just over $40,000 and had one and a half employees. Since then, the government announced in its budget that it would provide funding to help minority community media, and the action plan came out. The additional funding to help minority community media will certainly help us, as these media are in precarious situations, like we were. This was in the budget, not in the action plan. We will soon be getting $50,000 in assistance. The problem with this investment from the government is that we have been told not to hire staff with this money.

We have one and a half employees, or one full-time and one part-time employee who work between 60 and 80 hours a week. One of them is here this morning. We have been told to use the money to develop new markets, and so on. We need a staff member to do that. I recommend that the government at least set a percentage. I would not mind if the government decided that 30% of the money could be used to hire employees, but the media need to be able to use some of this funding to hire staff.

The action plan investments in the young Canada works program have allowed us to hire an intern, an entry-level journalist, for one year. This is a very important resource. We will be growing to two and a half employees, which is very much needed. Next year, we will be allowed to hire another intern. I'm sure you understand that these interns need orientation, training and supervision. In return, they learn and gain experience so that they can find a full-time job at the end of the year. This means that, at the end of the year, when they've finally found their footing and are starting to understand how things work, we'll have to let them leave and find someone new. We start over from scratch.

As an employer, I assure you that if a year of experience can help them get a job, two years of experience would make it even easier for these journalists to join the workforce. I recommend that the government look at allowing newspapers to decide whether they want to keep the same intern for two years, in order to provide more stability and to give new journalists a two-year internship, which would make it easier for them to get a job afterwards.

I want to take this opportunity to remind you that these long-awaited, much-appreciated investments are absolutely essential to the survival of our newspaper, but they are one-time investments, which do not reverse the damage caused by the cuts to federal advertising we've experienced, which are in violation of the Official Languages Act.

One-time financial assistance is certainly helpful, but the annual shortfall is no different. We are talking about $50,000 a year. An investment of $50,000 this year to help us out of a difficult situation will not be renewed next year. We are talking about $50,000 a year for us, and about $2 million a year for all of our francophone minority newspapers. I urge the new Minister of Canadian Heritage and Multiculturalism, the hon. Pablo Rodriguez, whose mandate is to work with newspapers and manage federal advertising, to right this wrong as soon as possible.

Now, I would like to speak, not as the president of the Coopérative des publications fransaskoises, but as someone who has rather good knowledge of our communities. I have to say that the only part of the action plan I support is the part about the Canadian francophonie. I work with all parties, as long as the work will support the Canadian francophonie.

The action plan reflects the cross-Canada consultations on official languages reasonably well. I say reasonably well, since we were heard, but the investments fall short of the demands and the needs. There were a lot of oversights in Saskatchewan. The topics of women, equality and parity are hot topics now, as are family caregivers, the majority of whom are women, and assistance for seniors, yet the Fédération provinciale des Fransaskoises has not received funding for programming in three years, and its only project was denied.

The Fédération des aînés fransaskois, which submits programming requests, has not received funding for five years because there supposedly is not enough money. This federation has been granted a $30,000 project, but no money for programming. This means that it will not receive the additional 20% that everyone received because it did not have any programming. This may not seem like much, but for an organization that is receiving $30,000, it's a lot.

Since there is more money this year, I recommend that the so-called project granted to the Fédération des aînés fransaskois be converted into programming and that it be granted a substantial increase so that it can develop this programming.

I also recommend that support be given to the Fédération provinciale des Fransaskoises. I'm not necessarily talking about financial support, but the federation doesn't have the material and human resources to submit a detailed programming request for next year.

It takes longer than expected to implement the action plan, and most of our organizations are worried about this. In the past, we sometimes had to wait more than a year for implementation. This meant that we sometimes didn't have access to all of the initiatives and their financing. A lot of time is spent setting the criteria. Once they're set, we're given three months to implement them, but we don't have enough human or financial resources to do so.

The government should not only consult the communities about the criteria, but it should also explain to them how the consultations are factored in. There should be a mid-term evaluation. This was done in the past as part of the roadmap. However, at the time, the evaluations were simply anecdotes. There was no information about where the money had been invested. The money from the last two roadmaps still hasn't been fully invested.

I therefore suggest that at the end, if all of the money announced hasn't been spent, that it be given to all of the organizations according to the formula currently used.

11:25 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Denis Paradis

Thank you very much, Ms. Kenny.

You can add comments during your discussions with colleagues.

11:25 a.m.

President, Coopérative des publications fransaskoises

11:25 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Denis Paradis

I will now call on Roger Gauthier, the young president of the Fédération des aînés fransaskois.

11:25 a.m.

Roger Gauthier Fédération des aînés fransaskois

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I am grateful to the committee members for coming to see us in Saskatchewan. Like others, I strongly encouraged the committee to travel to Saskatchewan, and I am very happy to see you here.

I am not the president of the Fédération des aînés fransaskaois; I am the delegate. Unfortunately, our president, Jacqueline Plante, is on sick leave at the moment. That happens as people age: health issues come up.

I would like to thank Ms. Kenny for taking a minute of my time to second what I am about to tell you. The Fédération considers people 50 and over to be seniors. Some people think 50 is a bit young, but when people are between 50 and 65, they start getting ready to end their careers. When they get to that point, they have to be ready for it. At 65, people set their sights on living to 100. We all expect to live to 100, we are baby boomers, we are healthy, we are on the move, and we are very engaged. I have been retired for a year, I am very engaged, and I am glad I can continue to be engaged.

Fransaskois seniors live in both rural and urban environments. There are a lot of us in rural areas, and a lot of us are farmers. I should point out that farmers never retire. The average age of farmers in Saskatchewan is 55. That means a lot of them are seniors, still working the land with their wives. There are a lot of them. Sixty per cent of the Fransaskois population are seniors.

As you know, we will be a heavy burden on the Canadian population in the coming years because of the aging population.

Fransaskois seniors have impeccable French. They are the ones who demanded the right to education, family services and children's services. They are the ones whose blood, sweat and tears kept French language and culture alive. Now their top priority is quality of life. They want to remain in their communities. They want services in French and they want to participate in cultural development. That is why it is so important for them to engage in intergenerational initiatives.

We do not want to be shipped off to homes. We want to be healthy and live in our own homes for a long time. That is why home care is one of our big issues along with health promotion and social development programs.

That brings me to the Action Plan for Official Languages 2018-23. There are a lot of good things in the action plan, some good investments. Unfortunately, it does not have much to offer seniors. Its impact is more indirect, mainly in terms of investments in health and social development.

With respect to health, we would like to see those investments improve access to French-language health services for seniors, who will be one of the largest user groups in the next 20 to 30 years.

On the social development front, there have been investments in age-friendly cities and communities. We want cities and communities to be places where it is easy to live in French, places that are adapted to seniors. Age-friendly cities and communities is a World Health Organization program. The model and the approach are good ones.

Seniors care about culture too. We need to respond to that. We are grateful to organizations such as the Conseil culturel fransaskois for maintaining that vitality. We are proud of our young Byrun Boutin-Maloney, winner of the Festival international de la chanson de Granby. He was the first Fransaskois to win a prize at the festival. We have other artists like him. Seniors want to keep being active in arts and culture.

As Ms. Kenny said, unfortunately, the action plan left the Fédération des aînés fransaskois out in the cold. Even though we applied for programs for years, all we ever got was $30,000 per year. We get no support. We know that a lot of organizations want to work with seniors, and the Fédération des aînés fransaskois really is the organization that can help them open doors to work with that group of people, but we don't have the staff to do it. Right now, we have one person doing that half-time. That needs to change, but we didn't get the 20 per cent.

It's too bad the action plan was finalized before the federal-provincial health agreements for mental health and home care were signed. Those agreements didn't include any official language obligations. The provinces are starting to work on home care and mental health issues, both of which are really important to seniors. We know that mental health and home care are particularly important for our aging population.

In Saskatchewan, there are problems with French-language services. Services in French have gone downhill over the past 10 years. We often have to make phone calls if we want service, and even then we have to wait for hours. If we want service, we have to speak English. Actual French services are very hard to come by.

Modernization of the Official Languages Act—

11:30 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Denis Paradis

Mr. Gauthier, I have to stop you there because it is about 25 minutes to noon. You can elaborate on what you've been saying when it's time for questions and comments from committee members.

We are going to dive right into the first round. If we want to wrap things up on time, I would ask each committee member to take about five minutes.

Ms. Boucher, you have the floor.

11:30 a.m.

Conservative

Sylvie Boucher Conservative Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC

Good morning everyone. I'm very glad you're here. I can speak only for myself, but I always enjoy talking to francophones from outside Quebec. As Ms. Campagne said, francophones from Quebec are the majority, so our experience is not the same as yours.

Ms. Campagne, what you said about how Quebec should realize that not all artists are from Quebec really had an impact on me. When I was young, I listened to Hart Rouge, Roch Voisine and Daniel Lavoie, and everyone thought those artists were from Montreal. Nobody knew they were francophones from outside Quebec.

You are part of a group, and you are familiar with the dynamics in the music scene. Why is it that francophone Canadian artists still have to do time in Montreal to make a name for themselves in 2018? Why is that? I have been a member of this committee for almost 10 years. I have been on other committees, but I have worked on the official languages file for almost 10 years. I really don't see why francophone artists from Saskatchewan or Manitoba should have to live in exile to pursue their careers.

11:35 a.m.

Director, Conseil culturel fransaskois

Suzanne Campagne

I moved back to Saskatchewan because I didn't like the idea that anyone who wanted to do this kind of work in French would have to relocate to Quebec. Hart Rouge did it because we had no choice, but now with the Internet and everything online, that could change.

As you know, Lord Byrun took top honours at the Festival international de la chanson de Granby, which gave him access to all kinds of showcases. However, he himself has to cover the cost of getting to Montreal to participate in provincial and international showcases. Travel is tough for our artists. They have to spend a lot more than other artists to get to francophone markets. In many cases, nobody picks up the travel tab from places like Manitoba or Saskatchewan to wherever the francophone audiences are.

New Brunswick has a program called the Stratégie de promotion des artistes acadiens sur la scène internationale, SPAASI, which supports artists who want to reach international audiences. SPAASI organized a showcase in Paris two years ago called La fable du bison et du homard, the legend of the bison and the lobster. It was a big success. Two of our artists, Shawn Jobin and Annette Campagne, toured in France and played major festivals as a direct result of that showcase.

The problem is that there is usually not enough money and not enough is being done to set up showcases in places other than Quebec. Those resources are practically non-existent. In recent years, the Liberal government has been paying more attention to arts and culture. Canada Council for the Arts funding went up twice, and the CBC got more money too, but unfortunately, none of that money is making its way to us. If the government doesn't fund organizations like ours, if I can use that as an example—

11:35 a.m.

Conservative

Sylvie Boucher Conservative Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC

Yes, that's okay.

11:35 a.m.

Director, Conseil culturel fransaskois

Suzanne Campagne

If organizations like ours don't get funding, we can't really create the space and opportunity for that to happen.

11:35 a.m.

Conservative

Sylvie Boucher Conservative Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC

I have one last question.

What can the federal government do to create a showcase for artists? I don't believe such a things exists for francophones outside Quebec. I won't include Quebec for now. I want to talk about the francophonie in the rest of Canada.

Are there incentives that current and future governments could set up? Can we get the government, whichever government that may be, to understand that culture is fundamental, culture is our foundation?

11:35 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Denis Paradis

You have one minute for your reply, Ms. Campagne.

11:35 a.m.

Director, Conseil culturel fransaskois

Suzanne Campagne

Okay. Earlier, I talked about how we need to see arts and culture as the lifeblood. Arts and culture always seem to be an afterthought in all the actions plans and roadmaps, even in the Official Languages Act. There seems to be this idea that only once people have jobs and food on the table can we turn our attention to singing and dancing, but the opposite is true. We need to devote more attention to arts and culture so that funding can flow to where arts and culture are happening.

11:40 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Denis Paradis

Thank you very much, Ms. Campagne.

Mr. Arseneault, you have the floor.

11:40 a.m.

Liberal

René Arseneault Liberal Madawaska—Restigouche, NB

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

That is interesting. It is true that I am a troubadour, but we are talking about artists like Hart Rouge and Daniel Lavoie. Angèle Arsenault, who is from Prince Edward Island, was the first Canadian artist that I listened to growing up. That was in the 1970s. Quebeckers may not remember this, but I believe she was the first artist or at least one of the first to receive the well-known Félix award. When the Félix awards were created, hers was the best-selling album in Quebec, and that was the case for several years. In short, I could name a number of artists, including Zachary Richard and other Acadians or Cajuns.

I myself participated in showcases when I was young because my main goal was to become an artist. It was impossible. What you are saying is entirely true. It was impossible. Things did not go well for me and I became a lawyer because I was worried about being a suffering artist. What's more, I am Liberal. I have all sorts of talents. In any case, I really like that idea. It has never been done.

That being said, Ms. Campagne, what I would most like to know is what happened to your poor brother, who was surrounded by I don't know how many sisters.

11:40 a.m.

Director, Conseil culturel fransaskois

Suzanne Campagne

I wouldn't really describe him as my poor brother. He always got pretty much everything he wanted out of life. There were six girls and one boy in our family—

11:40 a.m.

Liberal

René Arseneault Liberal Madawaska—Restigouche, NB

Six sisters. Poor him.

11:40 a.m.

Director, Conseil culturel fransaskois

Suzanne Campagne

That being said, what you are saying is true. It is difficult to recognize that some francophone artists come from other parts of Canada, which brings me back to my idea of promotion. We need to change the way we promote bilingualism and the French fact in Canada.

My brother is doing very well, by the way.

11:40 a.m.

Liberal

René Arseneault Liberal Madawaska—Restigouche, NB

I have two more specific questions.

First, Mr. Hopf, you studied common law in French, did you not?