Official Languages Committee on Feb. 28th, 2018

[Voices]

Hear, hear!

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

We could spend all day with them.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

It was absolutely superb.

We're going to suspend for a few minutes, but I would like you to stay seated so that we can take a group photo with the MPs behind you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

We will resume.

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(3), we will begin our study of French and English as second-language programs.

I would like to welcome the following witnesses: Damien Hubert, Director of the Alliance Française de Vancouver; Danielle Dalton and Patrick Witwicki, of the Association des francophones et francophiles du Nord-Ouest; Sophie Bergeron, of the Association provinciale des professeurs d'immersion et du programme francophone de Colombie-Britannique; Diane Tijman and Glyn Lewis, from Canadian Parents for French - British Columbia & Yukon; and Gino LeBlanc, Director of the Office of Francophone and Francophile Affairs, Simon Fraser University.

We will proceed like this. You will each have five minutes for your presentations. I will be quite strict in enforcing this five-minute period. We have a pre-determined amount of time, and we want to give the MPs the time to speak and ask questions after your presentations.

After your five-minute presentations, there will be a period during which MPs will ask questions and make comments. They will each have six minutes to speak; they know the rules of our committee. I just want to make sure you do too.

Welcome once more. We are extremely happy to be here with you in Vancouver today; it is truly special. We are learning very important things about the francophones who live here, as well as people who want to learn French. We would like to hear what you have to say.

I believe that we're starting with Mr. Hubert, right?

[Damien Hubert, Director, Alliance Française de Vancouver]

It's your call. No issue here, I would be glad to start things off.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

You have five minutes.

[Damien Hubert]

Very well.

The Alliance Française de Vancouver is a non-profit association whose mission is to promote French language and culture. It was created in Vancouver, in 1904. It is a long-established institution that is still alive today.

Before all else, we are a language school. This is what allows us to sustain ourselves, because we receive no funding from either the provincial or federal government. We are completely financially independent, meaning that the French classes keep the institution operating, pay the teachers' salaries, and create cultural programs, because our vision is to teach the language and bring French culture to life. We have a resource centre that is the largest French library in British Columbia, something that few people are aware of. We also offer a series of cultural activities.

When I say “language school”, I'm clearly talking about students enrolled in continuing education, meaning people who want to learn French of their own accord. They range from five-year-old children to ninety-year-old adults, maybe even older; I would have to check. In any case, the will to learn has no age limit.

We currently have approximately 2,500 students per year, which is relatively considerable and allows us to say that Francophiles and Francophones alike share an interest for French. This represents approximately 100,000 hours of classes billed per year, and 5,000 enrolments.

We offer classes in which French is taught as a foreign language. This is a particular way of teaching French that has an action-based approach, meaning that it revolves around interactions, scenarios and communication above all. Our students have the immediate possibility to speak and live in French through everyday activities.

In addition to the teaching component, we also offer cultural resources. If the students are given the possibility of having unique cultural experiences in French, it will be easier for them to integrate, assimilate and understand the language. We organize a little more than 60 events per year. Since the year is at its end, I can give you the numbers. In 2017, we welcomed 1,800 people, including students, Francophiles and Francophones, to our cultural events. The idea is to create opportunities for students and Francophones of all ages to get together and talk with one another, so that they realize that the French language is alive and well in Vancouver and British Columbia. They will also be made aware of the existence of French-language events, and the opportunity to practice speaking French in their everyday lives.

There. I have respected the five-minute speaking period.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you.

Ms. Dalton, you have the floor.

[Danielle Dalton, President, Association des francophones et francophiles du Nord-Ouest]

Good morning, I am the president of the Association des francophones et francophiles du Nord-Ouest. Today, Mr. Witwicki will be speaking to you.

[Patrick Witwicki, Executive Director, Association des francophones et francophiles du Nord-Ouest]

Thank you, Mr. Chair and distinguished members of the committee.

I am a Francophile and the executive director of AFFNO. I am a good example, I believe, of the importance of French immersion. I was in a French immersion program until I graduated.

Today, we have the choice to do our presentation in English or in French, but I decided to do it in French to show you the importance and the success of French second-language programs.

[Voices]

Hear, hear!

[Patrick Witwicki, Executive Director, Association des francophones et francophiles du Nord-Ouest]

You have all received the chronological presentation that explains what has happened over the last five years in our region with school boards and FSL. Today, I will use the five minutes I have to talk about our unique situation in northwestern British Columbia with respect to the French immersion program, the consultation process between our school boards in the northwest—we have four—and what associations such as ours request from those school boards. I will also look at the conflicts between FSL and indigenous languages and, finally, at the end of my speech, I will present my recommendations to the committee.

First, I will talk about the number one challenge we are facing in the north. We are in a very rural region; there are small towns everywhere, including Terrace, which is the largest with 15,000 residents. In the northwest, we do not have access to the same basic products as in the big cities. In addition, it is difficult to recruit teachers who also speak French to teach in the French immersion program. There is also a problem with waiting lists in places where the program does not exist. It is quite possible that our Francophones and Francophiles do not get an opportunity to study French at school, which is unfair.

There is also another problem: attrition in high schools. Since they are smaller than those in big cities, there are fewer options in high schools for students. So, there are always conflicts between course choices, and that causes attrition.

The challenges for school boards are primarily the budget and money. Right now, every school board receives funding for education in French, the amounts of which are in our submission. However, only 15% of those amounts can be used for administrative costs, such as salaries.

The same goes for scheduling. Students enrolled in our high schools experience many problems with the scheduling and planning of French immersion courses because of conflicts with other courses. So our number one concern with school boards is apathy.

As we mentioned in our brief, we have been disagreeing with our school boards, except Prince Rupert, for a number of years. Clearly, if school boards had a choice, they would rather not give courses in French. In addition, school boards do no advertising to promote the program. There is therefore a lack of support for students and teachers. I often hear parents and teachers in our area say that they feel helpless. They feel that the school boards do not want to do anything, and would rather let attrition continue to grow to the point where the number of registrations is so low that they will be able to cancel the program.

Finally, our situation in the northwest is unique with respect to FSL and indigenous languages. Indigenous languages are taught in schools in almost every city in our region. In Hazelton, for example, the combination of three languages works: every child has the opportunity to learn English, French and Gitanmaax, an indigenous language, and we think that's wonderful.

However, in Haida Gwaii, for example, the local school board, under a lot of pressure from the Haida chiefs, suddenly cancelled the immersion program because people were saying that Haida Gwaii's two official languages were English and Haida.

We want what works in Hazelton everywhere in our area, in the northwest and across Canada.

I know other associations will probably ask for the same thing, but here are our four recommendations to the committee.

First, the funding earmarked for teaching French as a second language and the percentage for administrative costs, which is 15% today, must be increased.

Second, school boards in rural communities should be given additional support to find teachers who speak French to teach French as a second language.

Third, teaching the second official language, French and, where applicable, the indigenous language of the region, should become mandatory and be protected by a constitutional guarantee, with a view to reconciliation.

Finally, fourth, the federal and provincial governments should develop an action plan to address attrition in high schools in remote cities. They should also find ways to support school boards, students, teachers and even parents so that the program can continue and be successful.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you very much, Mr. Witwicki.

We will now hear from Diane Tijman.

[Diane Tijman, President, Canadian Parents for French - British Columbia & Yukon]

Bonjour.

Good morning, Chair and members of the Standing Committee on Official Languages.

My name is Diane Tijman and I am the President of Canadian Parents for French - British Columbia & Yukon.

First, I would like to sincerely thank the Standing Senate Committee on Official Languages for the work that you do for Francophones and Francophiles.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

I would just like to clarify that this is the House of Commons Standing Committee on Official Languages. We are elected members; this is not the Senate.

[Diane Tijman]

I understand and I apologize. I just meant that the Senate tabled a report last May on Francophone and Francophile programs.

It was entitled “Horizon 2018: Toward Stronger Support of French-language Learning in British Columbia”. I think we have to recognize the tremendous amount of work that went into that report. It underscores the serious situation that we have found ourselves in, and the urgent need and call for action.

Yesterday was my birthday, and I received the greatest gift ever. Thanks to the government's announcement, I am much more hopeful today. Thank you.

However, I couldn't say much had really changed since the Senate report was released last May in British Columbia. In fact, in some locations, access to French language education has, frankly, been worse than it was last year: the most famous case being the Vancouver School Board's closure of five French immersion kindergarten classes, representing one of the greatest disappointments to us as a parent organization seeking and supporting bilingualism.

As president of the CPF B.C.-Yukon branch, I represent 7,000 members belonging to a national network of 25,000 members across Canada, seeking French education and cultural opportunities in French for our children. I personally am a mother of two children who completed the immersion program, and am someone who has worked as a French teacher and as a languages coordinator in Richmond. I benefited from the federal program Explore as a young teacher, and have studied both in Quebec and in France. My experience in French tells me that we are at a critical point in French language education in British Columbia.

Yes, we have much to be proud of, with 5,700 francophones enrolled in school, and 54,000 in French immersion, representing a growth in French immersion programs by about 65% over the last 20 years, and a growth of about 75% in enrolment in our francophone program. Nevertheless, success breeds demand, and for the last few years school boards such as those in Vancouver and Surrey have turned away hundreds of French immersion students' registrations annually. Anecdotally, I heard it was over 400 last year in Vancouver, and in Surrey, 250.

At CPF we hear from the many anxious parents concerned about their child not getting into the program, and for parents of children entering kindergarten immersion, there are very few options. They include waiting until grade 1, when the class size increases by two kids; or maybe waiting until grade 6, when some school districts offer late immersion, where you might get in if you win the lottery. To access the program, some parents might move to another city, commute to deliver their child to a school, or move in with relatives—I've heard—to attend a school that will allow them access. When I was working as a language coordinator in Richmond, I had one desperate parent who actually rented a garage so that she could use the address to obtain registration for her child in the program.

It's true that B.C. offers several options in French. The Conseil scolaire francophone offers an excellent francophone education, but obviously the number of schools is limited at this point, and the challenge of busing children long distances makes some francophone parents place their children in French immersion or even in English. Core French is widely available but ,frankly, requires added years of study to attain bilingualism. Intensive French is another quality option but is offered in only a handful of districts. Yes, French immersion is widely available, but enrolment is tightly controlled, with school boards placing artificial roadblocks such as enrolment caps, lotteries, and camp-outs, which prevent some children from getting into the program. Such impediments are, frankly, an insult to parents, but they do enable districts to keep a tight lid on enrolment in French. We can speculate on why districts might want to limit growth, but one fact is abundantly clear: we presently have a critical shortage of French teachers.

One other interesting point is that the French immersion program started in British Columbia in the late 1970s and now many of those graduates are becoming parents. They are the great Canadian success story, but to our dismay face enormous challenges in registering their own children in French immersion. As Canadians we celebrate the social and cognitive merits of bilingualism and the skills they bring, yet we provide no guarantee to a French language education. Yes, the charter provides these rights to francophones, but none that are guaranteed to francophile, and that's a fundamental gap that I believe needs to be addressed.

Canadian Parents for French appreciates the difficulties school boards face currently—finding teachers, classroom space, and appropriate resources—are not easy and we recommend a multi-pronged approach and offer a few recommendations including.... And thank you to our dear government for providing the announcement yesterday, but I ask that the government work with our ministry of education on specific targets, including expansion of teacher training programs in French here and across the province; expansion for specialist training for teachers and educational assistants to support inclusion and learning assistance in French; provision of mentoring programs for beginning teachers, and continued professional development in French, including immersion francophone intensive and core French; and expansion of professional development funds to allow teachers to further develop their language skills in pedagogy, as well as cultural understanding.

A market adjustment to teachers' salaries would be most beneficial. We're the second lowest in Canada and that is with the highest cost of living makes it most difficult to attract teachers from out of province here.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

I'll have to ask you to continue in answering questions maybe from the members later on.

[Diane Tijman]

All right. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

We want to hear from Glyn for a few minutes.

Glyn, go ahead.

[Glyn Lewis, Executive Director, Canadian Parents for French - British Columbia & Yukon]

My name is Glyn Lewis, and I am the Executive Director of Canadian Parents for French - British Columbia & Yukon. I am a product of the French immersion program in Burnaby, a suburb of Vancouver. I will communicate my notes in English because it is a little easier, but if you ask questions in French, I will be able to answer in either French or English.

I won't reiterate too much of what Diane has said. I think she has given a very good, comprehensive overview of the programs and the situation here in B.C. and the Yukon, but I will add a little bit, and then I will speak more specifically to my own personal experience and how that might relate to the Official Languages Act and any revisions that might be coming, or considerations for revisions.

There is a list of questions that we were presented with before we came. I reviewed them and there are three questions that I really want to focus on and drill down on a little bit more.

The first question was whether the quality of FSL programs meets the expectations of students and their parents. As you can see from Patrick's example, French immersion programs generally are very, very strong. I would say that is the case across Canada, but it's entirely the case here in B.C. and in the Yukon. We have excellent teachers. The program is very immersive. There's a very strong community that supports the program. The goal of French immersion, we always say, is for our graduates to become functionally bilingual by the time they graduate, and I think that is the case for most students who reasonably apply themselves. If you apply yourself a little bit more, I think you become incredibly proficient by the time you graduate.

Where I think there are legitimate concerns and challenges is with core French, core French being basic French. As Diane mentioned, it's a requirement that all students in B.C. take a second language course between grades 5 and 8. By and large the offering of that second language is French, and that's mostly because of incentives that come through federal French funding, but it doesn't have to be French. Students could take Mandarin or Punjabi or some other second language.

The enrolment in core French in B.C. is 180,000 students, so it works out that almost one-third of the entire student population in B.C. learns core French. Unfortunately, we've seen enrolment in core French drop precipitously over the last 20 years, and there is a host of reasons for this. I'll just quickly identify a few that we've seen.

One is the fact that teachers who are teaching core French consistently show in studies and in surveys that they themselves do not feel comfortable teaching French. They themselves don't feel comfortable speaking the language. A 2008 study that was done by Wendy Carr at SFU showed that 80% of elementary and middle school core French teachers do not feel comfortable speaking French, so you can only imagine the negative impact that would have on the learning of students or the inspiration of students to develop an affinity for the language and the culture.

The second concern we have with the core French is that, being sometimes isolated from francophone communities and the French language and French culture, you really need to have extracurricular activities to complement what you're learning in the classroom. That's why we have to look at exchange programs and furthering exchange programs and immersive cultural experiences to complement what they're learning in the classroom, to hopefully inspire them to continue to learn the language and to pursue the language. That was the one question I wanted to address.

The second question that I really liked, from the list I was given, was whether there are resources available to help immigrant students who do not have French as their mother tongue or official language spoken to integrate into French second language programs. This was a question about new Canadians and whether there are resources and strategies to help them participate in FSL programs.

By and large I think we have very good, high participation of new Canadians in FSL programs. There is a school in Burnaby where the majority of the families who participate in French immersion do not speak French or English at home, so these are families who would speak mostly Mandarin or Punjabi or some other language. I think generally speaking we see that new Canadians, when they come to Canada, see Canada as a bilingual country—more so, sometimes, than we see that ourselves—and they want their children to be part of this language. They want their children to integrate and to embrace the language and the culture of the place where they have landed and which they are now calling home, so they seek the program.

I think the challenge with those families—and Diane mentioned this in her remarks—is to make sure that we are creating enough space that we don't turn any of those families away. I just want to make that comment with respect to FSL for new Canadians.

The last one—and I am mindful of time—is the question of whether second language instruction should be protected by constitutional guarantees. This is a question that Diane mentioned in her remarks. We are graduates of programs like French immersion, but our children aren't guaranteed the same rights and access to learn French as well.

I live here in Vancouver. I can outline my backstory very quickly. My mom was born in Greece. She went to Paris to become a French teacher. She moved to Vancouver where she met my father who is a sixth-generation Canadian from the west coast. My mom is a multicultural, multilingual, internationalist, and my dad was a meat-and-potatoes, anti-French west coast guy. I have always wondered how they met and how they thought it was a good idea for them to be together.

[Gino LeBlanc]

You turned out well.

[Glyn Lewis]

Thank you, Gino.

My mom was persistant that both of her kids would learn French even though my dad was indifferent and derisive at times about the French language; again, this is a meat-and-potatoes west coast person. She persisted and I went through the late French immersion program in Burnaby and my sister went through the francophone program in Vancouver. I went to Simon Fraser University and studied chemistry, and I never thought I'd come back to the French language. After I graduated from university, I decided I wanted to live in Montreal. I wanted to see another part of the country, and I wanted to experience another part of the country. It was one of the best things that I did and I had that opportunity because I had French as a background.

When I was living in Montreal, I was invited to come back to work for Canadian Parents for French. I've now spent the last eight years advocating for kids just like me and Patrick so that they can have the same opportunities that have changed our lives.

It seems to me—and Diane mentioned this in her remarks—that the challenge is that because I live in a community like Vancouver, in a few years when I have kids, I will have to line up and I will have to put my name in a lottery to get my kids into these programs. It will be the luck of the draw whether or not they get to participate in the program.

My strongest recommendation for this committee is to recommend that we extend those rights and guarantees to families like Patrick's and mine.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you very much for this presentation.

We will now go to Mr. LeBlanc.

[Gino LeBlanc, Director, Office of Francophone and Francophile Affairs, Simon Fraser University]

Good morning, Mr. Chair.

Before I start my five-minute speech, I would like to thank the members of the committee for travelling here to the Franco-Columbian francophonie. I would also like to greet the Clerk of the Committee. We were at the University of Ottawa together a long time ago. We worked together. She has amazing skills. So I imagine that the report she is going to prepare will be excellent.

The Office of Francophone and Francophile Affairs (OFFA) is certainly not well known, but before I talk about it, I would like to say that what you heard this morning must be considered in combination with what you will hear this afternoon. In other words, for French as a second language to exist, there must be a francophone community and vitality. Ms. Tijman, Mr. Lewis and Mr. Witwicki said it, and I say it too: for French as a second language to exist, there must be living francophone communities in British Columbia, western Canada, Acadia and elsewhere. I would not want you to separate the two dynamics, since they come from the same reality.

OFFA is a product of the Dion plan. Mr. Chair will surely remember the Dion plan, made public in 2003. As for the Office of Francophone and Francophile Affairs at Simon Fraser University, it was founded in 2004.

I represent the post-secondary institutions in French, in British Columbia. The University of British Columbia, a sister university of Simon Fraser University, offers courses and trains teachers in French, of course. Political science, history and education are taught in French. This may surprise you, but it has been the case since 2004. In addition, we are rapidly growing. One of the things I would like you to remember, as Ms. Tijman and Mr. Lewis said, is that the demand is there and we are unable to meet it.

It's not as if you came here to evaluate how we spark interest in the French language and the culture. The interest is already there, even for newcomers. It is important to say it. In the minds of the people who come to British Columbia, French plays an important role. However, we cannot meet the demand.

I do not want to say what one group has said before, that money will fix everything and we need more. Actually, one of the key messages I want to convey is that the infrastructure is there. Simon Fraser University has an office, and we received $1.5 million in 2003 to offer courses in French, in education, political science and history. In addition, we have a French cohort program.

As I was telling Mr. Arseneault, tomorrow morning, I would be ready to start a criminology program entirely in French with about $300,000. I could hire professors and recruit between 20 and 30 students. The infrastructure is there and the machine is ready to operate, but there are not enough resources. I will not be criticizing the official languages funding in the last 10 years, but I can attest to the significant stagnation of funding.

OFFA is an example, as are the Conseil scolaire francophone de la Colombie-Britannique, which appeared before you this morning, community groups such as Canadian Parents for French and the Alliance Française de Vancouver, run by Mr. Hubert. The infrastructure is there. So you are not starting from scratch.

Four hundred million dollars was announced yesterday and $305 million is allocated to the Department of Canadian Heritage. How will those amounts go to the Official Languages in Education Program (OLEP)? We agree that we will be largely supported by OLEP.

How will the money get here? It is up to you to help us. It is up to you to answer that question. How can we convince the senior officials from the Department of Canadian Heritage that, in British Columbia and even in the west, if we want to have a more Canadian vision of the west, the machine is available.

The Université de Saint-Boniface and the Campus Saint-Jean are ready. Not only are they ready, but the demand is there. Spots in French immersion are awarded through lotteries, and people line up in the rain in Vancouver. That's the message I want to get across this morning. Of course, we can go into the details of how to accomplish this.

I come from Acadia and worked at the Université de Moncton for 15 years. I also worked at Mount Allison University, in Sackville. I saw what was there, but I have discovered a demand for immersion here. It is a dramatic increase. The problem is that, if we don't act quickly, the demand for core French will unfortunately decline, as Mr. Lewis said.

As Ms. Tijman said, today's parents are the products of Mr. Trudeau's vision of Canada's national duality. The time to act is now. If we do not act now, we will find ourselves on a slippery slope.

I will now go back to OFFA and Simon Fraser University. I sort of have my feet in French as a second language, but also in the francophone community. OFFA is a member of the Association des collèges et universités de la francophonie canadienne (ACUFC). The teachers I train will end up in immersion schools, just as they will end up in the Conseil scolaire francophone. I experience both those realities, to an extent.

I would like to devote the rest of my time to some more general remarks.

Mr. Lewis concluded by saying that perhaps fundamental rights should be considered for those wanting to learn the second official language. It is one of the questions that you submitted to us, and I say yes. I even think you should rethink the Official Languages Act, as the Senate is doing. It is outdated and we are starting to feel it.

Section 23 of the Charter does not apply to post-secondary education. For me, and for Simon Fraser University, the $2.1 million that the Department of Canadian Heritage and taxpayers are investing is not protected. There is no guarantee and those funds could disappear tomorrow. I imagine those speaking for early childhood have told you the same thing this morning.

At the Office of Francophone and Francophile Affairs of Simon Fraser University, we are talking about a continuum in education, and post-secondary education is important for us. Teachers need to be trained. That's what we are doing, just like the University of British Columbia and other institutions, but the shortage of teachers is felt.

Let me summarize the situation. I am going to see the Dean of the Faculty of Education to tell him that I will be training 52 teachers in French this year. The training for each of them costs from $10,000 to $12,000. Fifty-two teachers, that's the real number, by the way, but I would be able to double it tomorrow. I would need just $12,000 per additional student, which the province should pay. However, the discussion only goes so far, because neither the province nor the federal government is providing the necessary resources. I guess it's sort of the same situation for the University of British Columbia.

I do not want to limit the debate to the issue of resources alone, but I want to let you know that the infrastructure is already in place. All we have to do is move forward. Once the situation is resolved, we can finally enhance francophone vitality in British Columbia.

I will end on that note, and I am ready to answer any questions you may have.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you very much, Mr. LeBlanc.

My sincere thanks to all of you for your excellent presentations.

We will continue with our usual round, by asking the members of the committee to introduce themselves as we have done with the other groups. Please state who you are and what we are doing here.

We will start with Sylvie Boucher.