Official Languages Committee on March 21st, 2018

[René Arseneault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

I understand your schedule and I heard what you said. I understand that it is complex. We are not in your shoes and you are the experts.

In your determination process, is there some way to separate the issue for the official languages committee? We would like to see much quicker progress, strictly on the census questions related to enumeration.

Can Statistics Canada do that?

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

We can send you a draft of the questions. You have to remember, however, that it is up to Statistics Canada to determine the content. We cannot make exceptions for one part of the questionnaire over another. We have no choice. It is a matter of consistency.

With regard to methodology, Statistics Canada has the prerogative, under the Statistics Act, to choose the best way of conducting its census. I can assure you that the issue of rights holders is no exception.

[René Arseneault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Except that, in terms of finding the best way of enumerating rights holders, Statistics Canada has been doing things wrong for a generation; that is a fact. We need you to reassure us.

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

I do not know if Statistics Canada has been doing things wrong. All I can say is that there was clear pressure in 2006 for Statistics Canada to conduct a study of the vitality of official language minority communities, and thus to enumerate rights holders. Statistics Canada cannot decide to conduct studies on all subjects, even if it is an extremely important subject. There has to be the will to do it.

[René Arseneault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Okay.

If I understood our colleague Mr. Choquette's remarks correctly, 25% of the population will get the long-form census, versus 75% for the short form, and you do not yet know if the questions for the enumeration of rights holders will be in the long form or the short form. Is that right? Why not include them in both?

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

That is in fact something we are discussing. As I said earlier, the burden on respondents also has to be considered. There are general statistics, the law of large numbers, and so forth. For decades we have been able to demonstrate that we can get better results using one questionnaire or another. That is part of our prerogative regarding methodology.

[René Arseneault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Thank you.

Do I have any time left?

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

You may ask one last question.

[René Arseneault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Ms. Badets, you are the chief statistician. There is some catching up to do as regards schools in minority language communities. In your opinion, why not put the enumeration question in both forms? I know you are talking about it, but why not just go ahead and do it?

[Jane Badets]

I will answer in English.

[René Arseneault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

No problem. You can speak in English.

[Jane Badets]

We are in the process right now of determining which questions to ask on this subject, so we are looking at the methodology as well. This is part of the discussions that we will have. We will be doing qualitative testing, and then we do quantitative testing. It's the normal process we use for all censuses.

So we cannot determine that at this point. We have to do the testing in order to know the best place to put these questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Thank you.

Mr. Samson is next.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I want to thank the witnesses for being here today.

I am usually accused of giving long preambles and not asking enough questions. This time I will ask some questions, but I would like the answers to be brief.

I have to say that I was expecting to get the questions today, but you said they will be available on March 31. I was not here the first time you appeared before the committee.

When I did my master's, in 1984, I examined the whole issue of Acadian schools. Everyone clearly agreed that the number of rights holders is the justification for creating francophone classes and schools. Yet we have never taken the necessary steps to determine the real number of rights holders, and that really upset me.

I have three very specific questions.

The deadline for obtaining the questions that will be included in the census can be met, unless there is a catastrophe, such as a world war, that prevents you from getting the work done.

From a financial point of view, there is no problem since you have enough money to do it. Is money a problem or not?

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

If we need money, we will get it.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Okay.

You said the deadline is not a problem, unless there is a catastrophe.

Can you publicly confirm that please?

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

What I can say is that we have a deadline and our goal is to meet it.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

You will meet it unless there is a catastrophe.

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

Yes, unless there is a catastrophe.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Okay, thank you.

As we said, the cost is not a problem.

Let's talk about space now. Is there enough space in the questionnaire? This is not going to change the world. It was noted earlier that there might not be enough space because there are a lot of questions and that the whole thing would have to be reviewed.

Is there enough space to add questions?

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

I cannot say because that is subject to analyses, testing, and so forth. That is up to our methodology specialists. We have to look at all of that. That is why we have to know where to put the questions and how to ask them. As you know, the census forms are very detailed.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

Okay, but you are scaring me a bit, just as you scared my colleague from New Brunswick.

You are scaring me when you say that space is still an issue for Statistics Canada.

After all the analyses, discussions, and work that has been done, you think that adding questions is the best way of getting data pertaining to subsection 23(1) and paragraph 23(3)a). Is that what all the information you have received in the past year and a half tells you?

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

All I would say is that we are continuing to examine long-term alternative methods. As you know, there is tremendous change in censuses around the world. All I am saying is that, in order to meet the 2021 deadline, we had no other choice than to examine the census process in order to test those questions.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

I really like your answer.

Personally, when things evolve, I do not like to see losses. I would rather build. If there are other methodologies, I suspect they would be added to the future questionnaire. It is okay for now.

Am I correct in saying that, typically, all the questions included in the short form are automatically included in the long form?

[Jean-Pierre Corbeil]

Yes, all the language-related questions in the short form are also in the long form.