Official Languages Committee on June 13th, 2024

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Let me speak, Mr. Serré. You will see, because we are going to do the same thing as you.

Mr. Chair, they are referring to motions made in other committees. I would like us to talk about our committee. That is all I wanted to remind you of, so you could give members the necessary instructions.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Since we are all sensitive about points of order, I will say that this is not necessarily a point of order. If someone has knowledge of what goes on somewhere else and there is a coincidence, it may be important that the person report it. I am not saying that this is important to the chair or to other members, but this is not a point of order, unfortunately.

Continue, Mr. Drouin.

[Francis Drouin, Liberal, Glengarry—Prescott—Russell, ON]

I find it bizarre. I am referring to this motion, because the Conservative Party wants to publish a press release in the next few days saying that the members of the committee do not want to work this summer. That is clear. It is a strategy that has been used in the past. I am not impressed by it. We will be voting against it.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Drouin.

Ms. Ashton, the floor is yours.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Briefly, I would like to say that we all agree that the member's conduct toward the witnesses at this committee was very problematic. We will not be changing our minds on that.

However, we do not agree on the motion that has been put forward. We know that urgent meetings must be held in the case of a public emergency, a national security problem, for example, but that is not the case at present.

That said, I hope we can move forward with the committee's work as soon as possible, but we will not be supporting this motion.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Ms. Ashton.

Mr. Serré, the floor is yours.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I am going to be brief, because I have a lot of other things to say.

I represent a large 32,000 km riding. In the summer, we use the time to meet with our constituents. I think it is important to do that.

As I said, this same motion has been put forward at 24 parliamentary committees. The dates were the same. We work from September to June to do committee work. We are independent. We do our studies. When we talk about committees' independence, we are talking about the four parties around the table. As Ms. Ashton said, this is not a national security problem.

Coming back to Mr. Godin's motion, he wants us to adopt his motion, but he has clearly said that they would continue to engage in obstruction until we vote on the motion. In the motion, we are asked to sit this summer. It is important that Canadians understand that. Mr. Godin's motion cannot even be considered by the committee, because a committee is not entitled to tell a whip—

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

A point of order, Mr. Chair.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

That is a fact.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Just a moment, Mr. Serré.

We can have only one microphone open at a time.

Mr. Godin, we are listening.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

My colleague says it cannot be considered. We voted and we defied your ruling. It can therefore now be considered.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Mr. Godin, that is not a point of order. It is a statement of fact. We are going to allow Mr. Serré to finish.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Mr. Godin claims to follow the rules at all times, but in the article in House of Commons Procedure and Practice, which we follow, it clearly states that a committee may not tell a whip who can sit as members of a committee. We would like to do that, if there were a precedent. We have a big list of Conservative Party members who have done things on other committees, and to other witnesses, as well, whom we would suggest not participate. That is not the role of the committee.

Coming back to the Canadians who are listening to us right now: We are being asked to vote on the motion that Mr. Godin has submitted twice and we are discussing this morning, which proposes that we hold meetings this summer. That part is important. Why do they want us to sit this summer? It is no longer even about Mr. Drouin. If we adopt this motion, we may have to hold meetings this summer. What does that tell Canadians? The Conservatives are doing this every week, right now. They are talking about adopting reports to the House. If we adopt this motion, we will have to report it to the House. That is important.

Mr. Godin should be quiet, because I have the floor, Mr. Chair. I know he is not used to listening to other people, but it is high time for him to listen.

If this is sent to the House, it will delay all of the business in the House. Certainly, that is what Mr. Blanchet and Mr. Poilievre want. They do not want the budget to be adopted. They do not want the economic statement to be approved. There are a lot of good bills in the House, so if the motion against Mr. Drouin that has been moved here at the Standing Committee on Official Languages goes back to the House, that will call for days and hours in the House.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

A point of order, Mr. Chair.

There is an article that says we have to stick to the subject of the motion. This is not the motion we are talking about. We are talking about the motion I moved a few minutes ago. If he had listened, he might be talking about the real motion.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Mr. Godin, the remarks by your colleague on the right were 95% about what Mr. Serré is talking about. I let him continue and I reminded him a few minutes later about the substance of your motion. As chair, I have to make sure I am being fair to everyone. I assume that all members here want the same thing.

So I am going to let Mr. Serré speak, as I let your colleague Mr. Généreux. However, if I see that it is dragging on and we are not talking about the substance of the motion at hand, I am going to let him know, as I let your colleague know.

Mr. Serré, the floor is yours.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Mr. Chair, as I said, I am going to be brief.

If the motion is adopted as the opposition members want, it will be sent to the House. That is in the preamble of the motion from this morning, so it is very relevant. It will be sent to the House, and this will delay all the business of the House, including the budget, the economic statement and all bills in the House. This is obstruction, which is what Mr. Poilievre and Mr. Blanchet have confirmed they want to do. We have heard from the Minister of Official Languages, we have heard from the officials. Today, again, we ask the officials to come back, with the agreement of the committee, and Mr. Godin did not ask one question about post-secondary education during his six minutes' speaking time, not one. He talked about the order in council; he asked questions about Mr. Drouin's comments to the officials. This was really inappropriate.

To me, since we are talking about respect, I think we have to move on to the next stage. We have to vote on this morning's motion, without a doubt.

Clearly, we have a lot of work to do, and it is obvious that Mr. Poilievre and Mr. Blanchet have to stop playing games, because Canadians need a bill passed in the House of Commons, not things that have already been discussed here.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

If there is no further discussion, we will call the vote.

There are no objections.

Mr. Généreux?

I will ask the clerk to call the vote on the present motion made today by Mr. Godin.

I will read it to make sure we know what we are voting on:

That considering that the committee has accumulated lost working hours due to the obstruction by Liberal MPs who are trying to protect MP Francis Drouin and prevent his removal from the committee, it is resolved that the committee requests the Chair to hold at least five meetings between July 8, 2024, and September 13, 2024, to address the study on federal funding for minority-language post-secondary institutions as well as to finalize the report on economic development of official language minority communities and the report on language obligations related to the process of staffing or making appointments to key positions.

(Motion negatived: nays 7; yeas 4)

Mr. Godin, you have approximately one minute.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

In fact, Mr. Chair, I am going to come back to the initial question.

Could someone explain for me how it is that the Minister of Official Languages reports to the Minister of Canadian Heritage?

Do you think, given that, as far as the Official Languages Act is concerned, the Minister of Official Languages does not exist, the Minister of Canadian Heritage, who is one of the people in charge, with the President of the Treasury Board, should testify before the committee?

[Julie Boyer]

It is really up to the committee, depending on the witnesses you want to invite.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Do you think it is reasonable that in response to the committee's invitation to the Minister of Canadian Heritage, she did not agree to testify here?

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

That is an excellent question, but your time is up; it was extended. There is no more time for questions, because we have reached the finish line.

Before I adjourn, I want to point out that we met as a subcommittee, at the request of the committee, in order to submit a report on Monday. Do you prefer to do it in camera? It relates to the education continuum. Do you want to do it publicly? It will take at least 15 to 20 minutes. Are you leaving it to the chair's discretion? The first 15 or 20 minutes will deal with a report that the subcommittee is to submit to this committee. I am letting you know, and it will be up to you to decide. I suggest that we do it in camera.

It will be in camera, so wait until the next invitation. We are going to resume where we were this past Monday, with Mr. Drouin on the speaking list, which everyone knows. It will be noted.

Mr. Beaulieu, I am listening.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

If we do it in camera, the report has to be submitted to the committee for it to be adopted.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

I suggest that the committee meet in camera to hear the recommendations of the subcommittee on the education continuum.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

The committee would sit in camera.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Yes, it would sit in camera for the first 15 or 20 minutes.

Is everyone happy with that? Yes? Fine.

With that, we will adjourn on the same terms as the adjournment last Monday.

I would like to thank the witnesses.

Have a good day.

The meeting is adjourned.