Official Languages Committee on Feb. 26th, 2024

[Mylène Letellier]

The federal government issues calls for proposals through Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada. These calls are for everyone. There are requests for a bilingual program for both francophones and anglophones. Often, when minority organizations such as ours compete with majority organizations, the criteria, the impact and the numbers obviously cannot be compared.

Let's take the example of an organization like ours, which helps 7,000 francophone businesses, and compare it to what an organization that serves anglophones can do. The number of companies is much larger. You'll understand that we represent 2% of the population, whereas they represent 98%. Sometimes it's a little difficult to compare us to them. It's often suggested that we get closer to anglophone organizations. Sometimes it's possible and it works well, and sometimes it's a little more complicated. We depend on the goodwill of each organization. That's what I meant.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Ms. Letellier.

Mr. Beaulieu, you'll have to be very disciplined because you have the floor for only one minute.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I'll jump in really quickly. There is one measure that could help you. It was in Bill C‑13, which created a new act to provide the right to access services in French in federally regulated businesses. Have you heard of that? Do you think that's a good thing?

[Marie-Eve Michon]

I can't comment on that act because I'm not familiar with it. I don't want to say just anything. I'm sorry.

[Reginald Nadeau]

I'm not familiar with it either.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Okay, we'll see. We hope—

It already applies to Quebec. It seems to me that it's supposed to apply in the next two years in all the regions.

[Reginald Nadeau]

Hopefully.

[Marie-Eve Michon]

Allow me to add that, when it comes to employees, we make sure they're French‑speaking because that's part of our mission, which is to promote the francophonie in business. The difficulty is that people often choose the three major centres in New Brunswick, which are in the southern part of the province. The Moncton region is bilingual, whereas in the other two major centres, bilingualism leaves a lot to be desired. The francophone communities are mainly in the northeast. It's difficult to choose a rural area because the cost of living is extremely high. There's no public transit. So it's much harder to choose to settle in a small community in the northern part of the province.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Ms. Michon and Mr. Beaulieu.

Ms. Ashton, you have the floor for one minute.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I have the same question as before, and it is for Ms. Michon. It pertains to the impact of the labour shortage, especially in our schools and French-language day care centres.

How is it impacting the economy of francophone communities in your area?

[Marie-Eve Michon]

There is no question that there is a labour shortage in all sectors, but it is especially critical in education and health care, given the issue of recognition of credentials. This obviously has to be addressed; we need to break down the barriers and walls. We have to try to relax the requirements.

We are in the process of preparing information sessions for immigrant candidates to make them aware of jobs in the education sector other than teaching, in order to encourage them to work in schools and thereby lighten the load on the staff. We created this partnership with school districts, among others.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you very much, Ms. Michon and Ms. Ashton.

I want to thank the witnesses.

I know it is irritating to be cut off, but I had to do that because we will be welcoming the next witness panel and the sound checks have to be done.

If you wish to submit any further information to the committee, feel free to send it to our clerk, who will pass it on to the committee members. The committee would really appreciate that, and it will help us draft our report.

Once again, thank you for taking part in this process. It has been very interesting. As I said, don't hesitate to send us any further information that might be relevant.

On that note, the meeting is suspended.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Mr. Chair, before the witnesses leave, I would like to say hello to Ms. Letellier, whom I had the privilege of meeting last week.

Ms. Letellier, please give my regards to the people of British Columbia.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Godin.

The meeting is suspended.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

We are now beginning the second part of the meeting.

I want to welcome the witnesses. Mr. Fortin, we will try to resolve all the technical issues so you can give your testimony.

For those of you not familiar with virtual meetings, I want to say that even though we can hear Mr. Fortin clearly, there is a problem at the console, between the transmission and the interpreters. That is where the sound has to be optimal.

So I would like to welcome Mr. François Vaillancourt, a professor who is appearing as an individual. Welcome also to Ms. Cathy Pelletier, general manager, not to say mother superior, of the Edmundston Region Chamber of Commerce, which as I said is the nicest region in Canada. I am in a conflict of interest here since I know Ms. Pelletier well. I also know Mr. Pelletier, who appeared earlier.

Finally, I want to welcome Mr. Roch Fortin, the owner of Maple Roch, who we hope will be able to join us soon despite the technical issues. Mr. Fortin, I understand you learned the maple syrup business in New Brunswick. I suspect it was in the area I come from.

As to how we will proceed, each witness will have a maximum of five minutes. You will then be asked questions by each political party. I am very strict with your speaking time to ensure that committee members can ask as many questions as possible.

We will begin with Mr. Vaillancourt.

You have the floor for five minutes, Mr. Vaillancourt.

[Prof. François Vaillancourt, Professor, As an Individual]

Thank you very much for having me.

Mr. Arseneault, I also want to mention that my wife is from the Madawaska Valley, so I agree with what you said about the great things that Edmunston and that part of New Brunswick have to offer.

Someone said earlier that French is a difficult language. My wife, who is a speech therapist as well as being from the Madawaska Valley, would disagree with that statement. She would say that English is actually harder to learn than French because of the many identical sounds that are written very differently. The argument that French is a tremendous challenge to immigrants as compared to other languages may not be entirely true.

I want to say three things. First, you might be wondering what an economics professor has to say about language. Economists have in fact been interested in the field for about fifty years. For economists, language has two components: first, it is a cultural feature, something that very often partially defines who we are. Above all, though, it represents human capital, which is the most important thing to us.

Human capital equates to what you have. Most of you have postsecondary education or fairly specialized training. You have acquired skills in the labour market or in politics. That is what we mean by human capital, but in 99.9% of cases, language is what allows you to make that specialized human capital accessible to buyers in the market and to other people you interact with. If you don't know the required language, it doesn't work. My first observation is that it is a person's human capital that interacts with the human capital of other people.

My second observation, perhaps more interesting, pertains to the research conducted recently in Switzerland by professor François Grin regarding multilingualism. In Canada, people are bilingual, and in Switzerland, people are bilingual or even trilingual. That research showed that the more languages a person knows, the greater the diversity, and the greater the person's originality and ability to contribute in areas that benefit society.

In other words, there are benefits to having more bilingual people and promoting French more widely, for minorities and the anglophone majority alike. Those benefits affect the economy indirectly, to be sure, but it makes us more mentally alert. People have always said that bilingualism helps protect against cognitive decline, but it also seems to benefit young people and give rise to interesting thinking.

My final observation came to me while I was listening to the last witness, who asked the federal government for more money. In this regard, I would point out something that is very obvious to an economist: spending wisely is important, but not spending in every case is equally important.

So if you make recommendations, try to think of how the money can be invested as effectively as possible. Is it by increasing the demand for services offered by francophone businesses? Is it by increasing the supply of francophone workers in order to offer services in French? It will depend on the circumstances.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I don't think I have gone over my time limit.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Vaillancourt.

You spoke for three and a half minutes, so you were under the time allotted.

Ms. Pelletier, you have the floor for five minutes.

[Cathy Pelletier, General Manager, Edmundston Region Chamber of Commerce]

Hello. Thank you for inviting me to join you today.

My name is Cathy Pelletier, as Mr. Arseneault said. I am the general manager of the Edmundston Region Chamber of Commerce.

I am also pleased to say that the Edmundston Region Chamber of Commerce is the largest francophone chamber of commerce in New Brunswick.

The role of our chamber of commerce, as you know, is to always provide the best support possible to our businesses in terms of economic development. We manage two initiatives to support our businesses. First, we operate the Retiree Employment Agency, which has a pool of retired persons. We also have the Emploihabilité Plus service, which helps people with special or specific needs return to the labour market.

Our chamber of commerce has over 360 members, from the smallest businesses to the biggest, including manufacturing and the tourism sector, which is quite strong in the region.

We are in the northwest of the province. We of course share a border with the United States on one side, and also share a border with Quebec. Given our unusual geographic location, it is not always easy to host or accommodate people or businesses.

I listened to the witnesses earlier and can say that the majority of our businesses are run by francophone entrepreneurs. Given our geographic location, however, they need to offer services in English, and increasingly in Spanish as well.

I will stop here and wait for the members' questions. I will answer to the best of my ability.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you very much, Ms. Pelletier.

Mr. Fortin, you have the next five minutes.

[Roch Fortin, Chief Executive Officer, Maple Roch]

My name is Roch Fortin. I live in the municipality of Summerland, British Columbia.

My presentation today will be in two parts: first, I will talk about my experience as a francophone in Canada, and secondly, my experience as an entrepreneur in British Columbia.

To begin, I left Quebec in 1979 after I graduated. I was hired by the RCMP in 1980 and travelled all over the country. In the 1980s, francophones in western Canada faced a lot of challenges. Honestly, it was a bit tough as a francophone, but I liked my career. Once people got to know me personally, we all became good friends. This year, 44 years later, our little detachment from Hope will reunite here in Summerland. It's a great story.

My career took me to Whistler, Richmond, fighting drug-related activities, to Vancouver headquarters, to Ecuador, Haiti, Mackenzie, Montreal and Yellowknife. I ended my career as district chief on the Acadian peninsula, in New Brunswick. I have worked in every province in Canada. I have met a lot of incredible people. I have a lot of memories from my years with the RCMP.

I also have two children: Luc who is 17 and is in grade 11 at a francophone school in Penticton, and Samuel who is 19 and is in his second year of political science at Vancouver Island University. I mention my sons because they are both perfectly bilingual. Seeing them speak French with my parents and the rest of my family in Lévis gives me cause to celebrate.

I am proud of them and I want to thank all the MPs and all the people who made it possible for my children to be educated in French.

That brings me to the second part of my presentation. After retiring from the RCMP, I promised to help the people on the Acadian peninsula as much as possible economically. I moved to Summerland, British Columbia. We started importing maple syrup from New Brunswick. I started with an order of six barrels of maple syrup from Mr. Rioux from Saint-Isodore. Then we imported maple syrup from Paquetville. Now we import maple syrup from Mr. Côté from Saint-Quentin. We also work with Mr. Fontaine from Saint-Philémon, Quebec, with his unique products.

Twelve years later, we order 200 barrels of maple syrup per year, and our local partners in British Columbia have created more than 20 maple syrup products. Today our social enterprise has eight employees and our clients include the Vancouver, Calgary, Edmonton and Kelowna airports. We also supply maple syrup from New Brunswick and Quebec to chefs in British Columbia through Sysco, and we import lobster from New Brunswick for special events in our region.

As a francophone business in an anglophone region, we face certain challenges. For instance, we have to explain to officials in British Columbia that we contribute to the agri-tourism and food sector even though the maple syrup comes from eastern Canada.

Further, as a small company, it is very difficult to navigate all the programs that are offered. Many companies like ours do not have the necessary staff to fill out all the paperwork.

There are two ways to support small businesses like ours. The first is to create a national tourism register listing all the small businesses that offer services in French in Canada. The register would help visitors from Canada or other countries know what to visit.

Secondly, the federal government should support minority-language small businesses by promoting their unique products to embassies and consulates. On the whole, big companies that are close to major centres have an advantage over us.

As to the official languages, it is important for package labelling and related documentation to be in both official languages in Canada. Right now, a lot of businesses are cutting corners—

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Fortin.

You will have the opportunity to say more when you answer the questions from members.

[Roch Fortin]

Okay. My apologies.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

No problem.

Now that our three witnesses have got the discussion rolling, we will begin with the first round of questions. Each political party will have six minutes.

We will begin with the first vice-chair of the Standing Committee on Official Languages. Mr. Godin, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I will ask my questions quickly.

Mr. Vaillancourt, I agree with you that it is much more difficult to learn English than French. I know from personal experience. Further, in your opening remarks, you reminded us of the importance of spending wisely, but also spending less. Investing and managing our investments wisely is a good motto that the federal government should follow every day.

My first question is for Ms. Pelletier, who represents the Edmundston Chamber of Commerce.

Ms. Pelletier, you mentioned that New Brunswick borders the United States and Quebec. The regulations that apply in Quebec and in Maine are obviously not the same.

How can the federal government facilitate access to the Quebec market, for instance? We will talk about the U.S. market another time. Our concern is facilitating trade between Quebec and New Brunswick.

Can you make any recommendations? What would you like to see in our report?

[Cathy Pelletier]

Those are good questions.

Let me tell you how things worked before.

At some point, I don't remember exactly when, after a meeting of the Congrès mondial acadien, what we call a “team of leaders” formed a committee made up of representatives from Maine, New Brunswick and Quebec. The committee's mandate was to take steps to improve or maintain dialogue between the provinces, territories and countries. Unfortunately, that committee is in decline as a result of the COVID-19 pandemic and other factors. I think it should be revived and action should be taken, even if it requires some funding. It existed before, and it was a winning formula. As a result of the pandemic and the lack of funding and support, it is now in decline. It led to some very positive initiatives, including a buyer day, for instance. On that day, businesses had the opportunity to meet with subcontractors or small businesses to develop new contacts or new collaborative initiatives in the Acadie des Terres et Forêts region. It was a great initiative, but now it is in decline, unfortunately.

Would it be possible to revive it? I think so, but we would need some support.