Official Languages Committee on May 9th, 2024

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Mr. Chair, this is a madhouse.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

All I want to know is how it works.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I raised a point of order before you, Mr. Samson.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

No, I'm still waiting for a vote on the decision of the chair. If my colleague wants to challenge the chair on the admissibility of the motion, he need only do so and there will be a vote. It's not complicated.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

That's—

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Okay, then.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I raised a point of order to—

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Hold on, everybody. Out of respect for the interpreters, I ask that you speak one person at a time.

I repeat what I said earlier: Given the way it would be amended by the amendment and subamendment that have been proposed, the motion is not in order, and I've explained to you why. The only procedure possible—and this is consistent with what Mr. Godin heard yesterday in the House of Commons—is to report to the Speaker of the House. The committee has to send a report to the House; that's all it can do.

Mr. Samson is right. He asked for a ruling on it, and I just ruled on it. Now, the committee can accept or not accept the ruling.

If it's accepted and then there's a resolution to ask that it be reported to the House—

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Wait, Mr. Beaulieu, I'm going to finish what I'm saying.

First of all, the committee can decide to accept or reject the chair's decision. In the first instance, the committee can accept it and ask to report back to the House. That's one solution. In the second instance, the committee can reject the chair's ruling on the amendment, the subamendment and Mr. Godin's motion, and it will go back to the House in that case as well. We have to choose one or the other.

Since a vote has been called, I have no choice but to proceed with it.

Mr. Beaulieu, if your point of order concerns this procedure, I will give you the floor. If not, we'll go to a vote.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Absolutely.

I see that as a no‑brainer. We don't have the power to remove the member from his position as a parliamentarian, but we do have the right to call for it. As a committee, we have the right to have opinions and make requests. We don't have the right to expel him, that's for sure. We don't do that. We ask that he apologize, we give our opinion, and we recognize that he isn't worthy of being a parliamentarian. So I think that—

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

I understand all that, Mr. Beaulieu, but I don't want us to fall into—

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I therefore challenge your decision, Mr. Chair.

[Darrell Samson, Liberal, Sackville—Preston—Chezzetcook, NS]

There you have it, Mr. Chair: We are calling for a vote.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

We are asking for a vote, but just before that, I will refer to page 1058 of our green bible, our rule book that contains House of Commons jurisprudence. I'm going to read to you verbatim an excerpt that applies to the current context. It's under the heading “Disorder and Misconduct”, in the section dealing with committees and questions of privilege.

However, neither committees nor their Chairs have the authority to censure an act of disorder or misconduct. If a committee desires that specific sanctions be taken against those disrupting the proceedings, it must report the situation to the House.

That's what I am explaining to you.

Having said that, the vote has been called, and we will go to a vote.

[Marc Serré, Liberal, Nickel Belt, ON]

Mr. Chair, I—

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

There has to be a report.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Mr. Chair, Mr. Généreux's amendment asks that the committee report this incident to the House.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

That's what I've been explaining to you for a while now. Read all the proposed amendments and subamendments in their entirety. In this form, it isn't admissible.

The vote has been called, and it's too late. We'll go to the vote.

That said, there are other things we can do.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

What are we voting on, Mr. Chair?

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

We are voting on my decision that Mr. Godin's motion, given the way it would have been amended by the amendment and subamendment, is not in order, for the reasons I have explained to you.

(Ruling of the chair overturned: nays 6; yeas 4)

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

According to procedure, given the result of the committee's vote, the motion becomes in order. We will continue the debate at the stage we were at. Mr. Beaulieu had the floor. The subamendment has been circulated.

Were you finished your remarks, Mr. Beaulieu?

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

No.

As for the second point, I consider that the behaviour at issue is obviously not worthy of the role of chair of a parliamentary association, all the more so since the member refused to apologize for four days. He made it worse by saying that it was not only extremist, but simplistic as well and that it came down to taking him for a fool. I think the consequences are much more serious. It’s become insulting to all those who defend French in Quebec and have the same opinions as these researchers.

It seems that by apologizing this way, somewhat hastily, the member is trying to sweep it under the rug.

Even the Prime Minister made it worse by saying that those who defend this point of view want to isolate Quebec, or even that we are against Franco-Ontarians. We are absolutely not against Franco-Ontarians or francophones outside Quebec. We’ve always supported them here, in the House.

[A member]

Oh, oh! (laughter)