Public Accounts Committee on Nov. 23rd, 2011

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

On another occasion, certainly, this issue will be before committee.

Mr. Dreeshen.

[Earl Dreeshen, Conservative, Red Deer, AB]

Thank you very much.

I, too, would like to echo everyone's comments today on the great work you've done. It has been really interesting to get to know you and hear your perspective on the different things that have taken place.

I know I don't have very much time, and there are a couple of items I would like to talk about.

One of the key components of our economic action plan was the knowledge infrastructure program. I had an opportunity to go to different colleges and universities throughout the country to see the types of things that have happened and the great innovation they've been able to put together. Mr. Clement was here a while back, and he was the one who was responsible for the program and for looking at these measures that had to be put in place to ensure that taxpayers' money was spent appropriately.

I wonder if, in about a minute, you could talk about what you did see as far as our knowledge infrastructure program was concerned.

[John Wiersema]

What we saw with respect to KIP, the knowledge infrastructure program, Mr. Chair, was consistent with what we saw in the other two programs. The public servants who were involved in administering and delivering these projects did a good job. They monitored these projects very carefully, with frequent reporting, took corrective action where necessary, and ensured that those projects were delivered as expected. Where there were decisions to delay projects, or to extend a deadline, those decisions were appropriately supported as well.

[Earl Dreeshen, Conservative, Red Deer, AB]

Thank you.

I'd like now to go back to the issuing of visas. I've gone through the observations and recommendations, which talk about the initial training that visa officers had. We're finding that there are a lot of younger people who are coming in here, and they've had the opportunity to get the training over this last five years. That was mentioned in section 2.19.

It looks as though there's a lot of optimism that we're going in the right direction. There are a number of different things. I won't go through the percentages of uptake that you find in each of the departments for the different types of things that they're focusing on. Of course, as has been mentioned, there are those negative things that people have to look at.

I think, when we're taking a look at the recommendation and the response, you're going to see those two trying to work towards best practices and so on. I guess that's more of an editorial opinion from me.

I do have one last thing—and I know that I don't have much time—and that has to do with exhibit D.1 on page 41. The footnote having to do with the First Nations Statistical Institute talks about time ending on the 2008, 2009 and 2010—

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Briefly, because you're running out of time.

[Earl Dreeshen, Conservative, Red Deer, AB]

I'm sorry.

In 2010, there is a number that is associated with that particular event. I wonder if you could explain that.

[John Wiersema]

Very quickly, Mr. Chair, the Office of the Auditor General has not yet completed the audits of the First Nations Statistical Institute for the years ending March 31, 2008, 2009, 2010, or 2011, because the agency itself has not yet been in a position to present audited financial statements to us for audit. There is a matter of concern there.

We expect to be issuing those reports shortly, in the coming weeks, but that agency has not yet been able to produce auditable financial statements.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Thank you.

Now we will finish off.

Mr. Dubé, the last Conservative questioner will not be able to participate, in that we are running out of time. You can close off.

[Matthew Dubé, NDP, Chambly—Borduas, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I would like to quickly talk about chapter 1, where Canada's Economic Action Plan is mentioned. Forty-seven billion dollars was spent on the action plan and the point of it all, we were told, was job creation. But, in your report, you say that “the program was designed in a way that did not allow for performance measurement and reporting against this key objective”. A lot of time has been spent trumpeting the results of this program that was ultimately designed to create jobs.

Could you explain what you meant by “in a way that did not allow for performance measurement”?

[John Wiersema]

I will be very quick, Mr. Chair.

Our comments on measuring jobs apply to only one of the three programs that we audited, the community adjustment fund; that particular program had an objective specifically related to creating or maintaining jobs. Given that it established that objective, we expected that they would have had some mechanism to track the actual job creation. As I recall, Mr. Chairman, that's $2 billion out of the overall $47-billion economic action plan.

The other two programs we audited did not have specific objectives relating to job creation, which is why, Mr. Chairman, we strongly encourage and support the government's plan to prepare an overall report on the results of the economic action plan, both in terms of its success--or otherwise--in stimulating the economy and in creating employment early in 2012. We think it's important to complete that accountability process.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Fine. Very briefly, Mr. Dubé.

[Matthew Dubé, NDP, Chambly—Borduas, QC]

Of course, we would like to see a system like that implemented in the future. But is it your view that, even if we are just talking about $2 billion, which is still a lot of money, a system like that should have been implemented from the outset?

[John Wiersema]

I am not sure, Mr. Chair.

The methodology for counting jobs—part-time jobs, determining whether or not they're related to a particular project, downstream effects of spinoff jobs—is extremely complex. I don't think any country in the world--that I'm aware of--has developed a methodology to do that well. Therefore, we support the intent of the government to report on job creation using the macroeconomic modelling techniques. To do it any other way is fraught with so many problems that I doubt it would result in a reliable measure.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Daryl Kramp]

Thank you very much.

We've reached the conclusion of our meeting today from a time point of view.

Let me take this opportunity to certainly thank our witnesses for appearing here today and for all of their work in the preparation of this fall review and, of course, the work of their support staff as well. It takes quite a team to make it happen.

You've done a marvellous service for the Canadian people today.

Let me as well take this opportunity, serving as your vice-chair, to thank all of my colleagues on all sides of the table here for their cooperation and courtesy in getting through this process in a most comfortable fashion. Hopefully it's a harbinger of great things to come for the effectiveness of this committee. Thank you very kindly.

The meeting is adjourned.