Public Accounts Committee on Oct. 2nd, 2024

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Were you given any instruction by the Minister of Innovation or ISED, as part of this transition?

[Cassie Doyle]

We were given a formal mandate, which I referred to in my opening comments. That was provided to us in a letter from the minister, but we haven't had any other direction. That's our laser focus. It's the delivery of those three elements of our mandate: implementing the AG's report, restarting funding and transitioning SDTC into NRC.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Does the renewed contribution agreement make this clear?

[Cassie Doyle]

Yes, it does. It allows us to operate in a way in which we are in compliance during this transition period. It clarifies, in a number of instances, the reporting requirements, for instance, to ISED.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Has SDTC funding been unblocked yet? Is the board currently approving and disbursing funds?

[Cassie Doyle]

We are very close to issuing our first disbursements, but we have not yet started that process. I would say that we are within just a matter of weeks now, after the board has been in place for four months.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Williamson]

You may ask a very short question, or I can come back to you later.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

In terms of the speed of the disbursement, is there a reason for that?

[Cassie Doyle]

Again, it was important for us as a new board to ensure that we had all of the quality assurance processes in place, and there were a number of steps that we needed to go through in terms of our own due diligence before restarting funds.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Williamson]

Thank you very much.

Once again, Ms. Sinclair‑Desgagné is next.

Ms. Sinclair‑Desgagné, you have two and a half minutes.

[Nathalie Sinclair-Desgagné, Bloc, Terrebonne, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Ms. Doyle, you just said that, within a few weeks, the first payments can be made to companies that were eligible and that should have received payments several months ago, if not a year ago.

Will all of the eligible businesses start receiving payments within weeks, or only some of them? If so, what proportion of those businesses will receive payments?

[Cassie Doyle]

These payments are not initial payments, but they are payments that have been disbursed according to the calendar that was set up when these projects were approved. As I mentioned, the very first round of disbursements will go to those companies that have already been reviewed by the Auditor General and found to have no eligibility issues or conflict of interest issues. That will be the very first round.

As we get more certainty around our schedule, we could provide that information. I can't say with any exactitude when we will get to the others. As I mentioned, the Auditor General had recommended, and we've accepted that recommendation, to review every single project to ensure that it is in compliance.

[Nathalie Sinclair-Desgagné, Bloc, Terrebonne, QC]

Thank you.

In terms of the proportions, you're saying that those are the companies that were audited by the Auditor General. Very well.

The companies and consulting firms who are currently performing the audits—and have been for a number of months—what exactly are they doing? It has been several months, after all. Consulting firms are able to work quickly. Simon Kennedy told us that it was already under way in the spring. You've only been there for four months, but the consulting firms have been there for many months.

Could you please provide us with the timeline that is systematically provided in each response to an RFP?

For example, if Deloitte responded to the RFP and it was accepted, could you please provide us with Deloitte's timeline to perform the required audits of the companies?

[Cassie Doyle]

Yes, I could take this question under advisement and provide more information. I'll just add that we did not start this process until the completion of the Auditor General's report. It was only as the new board that we turned our minds to implementing this recommendation. Then we went through an RFP, and we selected the independent consulting firms. They are now reviewing against the eligibility as recommended under, I think, recommendation 6.29. It is that process that is under way now. For each project, they're going back to the original documentation that the project submitted and looking at every element of eligibility for the SDTC fund.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Williamson]

Thank you very much.

Ms. Sinclair‑Desgagné, do you want to ask a quick question or wait until the next round?

[Nathalie Sinclair-Desgagné, Bloc, Terrebonne, QC]

I'll wait for the next round.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Williamson]

Thank you very much.

Next up is Mr. Desjarlais.

Mr. Desjarlais, you have the floor for two and a half minutes, please.

[Blake Desjarlais, NDP, Edmonton Griesbach, AB]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Ms. Doyle, I'd like to quote the minister. He said:

For their part, SDTC employees will be offered employment with the NRC. Employees at SDTC have gone through a difficult and challenging period. Their dedication and hard work will ensure the continued success of our cleantech startups.

That was what the minister said in relation to some serious concerns about job security for some of the country's best professionals in this space. As you know, the professional services and technological sector is a difficult sector to second talent for. We've heard in this committee before from multiple audits that we're seeing a lot of companies really suffering from an inability to recruit properly.

This is something that I think is quite serious, because if we don't have these professionals within the public service, it leaves it to groups like GC Strategies, which we had to deal with in the past, as I'm sure you're aware. There is a tremendous bleeding of public funds to these random tiny private firms that can manipulate the public system in order to get more funding.

My preference, which I think is the preference of many Canadians, is to have good public servants who know how to do the job and aren't skimming off the top. That is what we need in order to make our country's public sector work more valuable and to deliver more value for dollar for taxpayers.

That being said, since you took this role, have you spoken to the minister or the deputy minister with regard to his commitment to see employees at SDTC transferred to NRC?

[Cassie Doyle]

I have not spoken to the minister since taking this appointment. We have been in touch with and spoken to representatives of the executive of ISED.

The board and I agree with you. We want to retain the deep expertise that has been developed within SDTC around sustainable technologies, so that's something that we are committed to.

[Blake Desjarlais, NDP, Edmonton Griesbach, AB]

Have they been offered jobs?

[Cassie Doyle]

The job offers have not yet come. We had to start with the information exchange, because, as you could imagine, the classifications and job titles, etc., are very different between SDTC and NRC.

That work has been ongoing, and we have a very good team we're working with at the NRC. I don't have a date for when the job offers will be made, but everything is working towards that as an objective.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Williamson]

Thank you, Ms. Desjarlais. You're right at the end. I'll add a little bit of time to your next round.

We're turning now to Mr. Brock.

You have the floor for five minutes, please.

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Good afternoon, Ms. Doyle. Thank you for your attendance.

Minister Champagne, on June 4, 2024, issued a press release in which he said:

Effective immediately, SDTC will also resume funding, under a reinforced contribution agreement with ISED, for eligible projects in a sector vital to our country’s economy and clean growth transition. In line with the Auditor General’s findings, my Department will enhance oversight and monitoring of funding during the transition period.

Did I hear you correctly in stating that, since your appointment in or around June of this year, you have not funded any projects to date?

[Cassie Doyle]

We were appointed the very same day as that press release. We have been—

[Larry Brock, Conservative, Brantford—Brant, ON]

Has there been no funding since that date?