Evidence of meeting #85 for Public Accounts in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was ncc.
A video is available from Parliament.
November 21st, 2023 / 11:30 a.m.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
Thank you, Chair.
Through you, thank you to our witnesses for joining us.
First off, where does the elevator go?
11:30 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer, National Capital Commission
The elevator goes down into the basement. The basement is a place where we store a lot of the materials and equipment. Many of these are of a size and weight that you can't transport via stairs. A freight elevator moves between the two storeys of the facility.
11:30 a.m.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
So there is a basement. That clarifies that point.
Your first year as NCC CEO was 2019. That was the year the budget was approved. You were fresh off from being a municipal councillor, where you were accountable to your ratepayers for value for money and for dollars.
In your first year, you saw a budget approved by your board for $8.6 million for this storage facility. As a former accountable politician, were no red flags raised at that point in your mind about an $8 million-plus facility?
11:30 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer, National Capital Commission
Mr. Chair, one thing I said at the outset that bears repeating is that $8 million is a lot of money. I have a responsibility to my board and to the taxpayers of this country to deliver all of the NCC budget as effectively and efficiently as possible.
If the question is about whether I asked questions, the answer is yes. I think the staff can confirm that a big part of my job is challenging numbers, asking questions and ensuring that we are delivering projects as effectively as possible.
11:35 a.m.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
As an addendum to that, were any considerations given to alternatives to actually constructing such a facility, including off-site facilities?
11:35 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer, National Capital Commission
Yes, there was some consideration given to whether or not this was a facility that could be built off-site. That was actually a line of inquiry I initiated shortly after arriving. The answer to that was no, in large part due to the fact that Rideau Hall, being 79 acres, is really the locus or centre of where a lot of the maintenance work happens. It wouldn't have been cost-effective to build something like this off-site. That was the conclusion, given the fact that the employees who work in Alexis's shop are based on site and need to have easy access to the equipment.
11:35 a.m.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
How many bidders were there for the contract that Pomerleau ultimately won?
11:35 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer, National Capital Commission
I wasn't at the NCC at the time.
Is that information that's publicly available...?
I think there were three, but I'm going to—
11:35 a.m.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
Can we confirm that in writing to the committee within three weeks at the most?
11:35 a.m.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
Thank you for that.
Pomerleau had the ultimate contract. How many subcontracts were there in total?
11:35 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer, National Capital Commission
In my recollection of the project, 20 subcontracts were bid in a competitive fashion.
11:35 a.m.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
How many of those were sole-sourced or had only a single bidder?
11:35 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer, National Capital Commission
I can answer part of the question in the sense that with regard to amounts below a certain amount, there would have been some sole-sourcing done for smaller amounts. As to how many single bidders there were within the 20, I don't have that information—
11:35 a.m.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
What is that amount in terms of where there would be sole-sourcing? What would be the dollar figure?
11:35 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer, National Capital Commission
I don't think we have it on hand. My guess is that it would be a small proportion of the overall contract amount.
11:35 a.m.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
Could you confirm all of that in writing for this committee, including the number of contracts, the amounts and whether they were sole-sourced or a single bidder?
11:35 a.m.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Was GC Strategies involved in any of these contracts?
11:35 a.m.
Conservative
11:35 a.m.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
Thank you for that. I know it's a little off topic, but it was something that we thought ought to get out in public.
In your corporate plan for 2022-23 to 2026-27, you write:
However, going forward, these are no longer viable means to mitigate the impact of the financial pressures as described in this Summary of the Corporate Plan. The NCC's operating reserves will be depleted by the end of the second year of the plan. Furthermore, the NCC's ability to generate additional revenues is reaching a plateau due to limitations in its legislative authorities.
This is in your corporate plan and is basically saying that your reserves are going to be more or less depleted, but at the same time, you're coming to us and justifying an $8-million-plus storage facility, or whatever we want to plan it—
