Public Safety Committee on May 22nd, 2018

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

I only have a minute left. Could you be fairly brief?

I have one other question to get in before my minute is up.

[Alexandra Laberge]

I don't think monitoring Facebook and social networks is the solution. Rather, I think that whistleblowing by the victims is the solution, and that you have to focus more on individuals who were charged.

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

No, I'm not talking about it being a solution. I'm asking if it should be a criteria that's included when you're looking to see whether someone should be able to purchase a firearm. Should it be one of the criteria?

[Alexandra Laberge]

I don't think I can answer on behalf of the FFQ today.

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

Okay.

Because I was asking a number of questions at the last meeting about gender-based violence, I've had a number of people contact me who say that it's not an issue. In fact, there is a website, Gun Debate.ca, where it says it's not an issue and that there are stats that show women are not targeted with firearms. However, when I go to the office of the chief coroner for domestic violence in Ontario, I see that 26% of women's deaths are caused by a firearm.

Yes, or no, would you say that women are at risk of violence because of firearms?

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Very briefly, please.

[Alexandra Laberge]

Their safety is not jeopardized by firearms, but by the people who use those firearms.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Thank you, Ms. Damoff.

Ms. McLeod, welcome to the committee. You have five minutes, please.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

Just before I get into my questioning of the witnesses, I believe you have on record a notice of motion, and I believe it should be a quick vote.

I'd like to move:

That, Greta Bossenmaier, newly appointed National Security Advisor to the Prime Minister, be invited to appear before the Committee at her earliest convenience.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

It was moved in the last meeting.

I'm moving to resume debate.

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

Is that not what we voted on first?

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Excuse us. We now have some clarification.

This is a fresh motion. Is there debate?

Mr. Fragiskatos.

[Peter Fragiskatos, Liberal, London North Centre, ON]

I move to adjourn the debate.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

There is no debate on this.

(Motion agreed to)

Thank you.

That brings us down to about three minutes.

[Cathy McLeod, Conservative, Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC]

Thank you to all the witnesses, and I apologize for that. Sometimes we need a quick minute to deal with some of the committee business that needs to be dealt with.

I grew up in an urban area and had no exposure to hunters, fishers, or guns until I moved to a rural community as a young married woman where I became much more familiar. One of the first things I witnessed was one of the farmers shooting a cougar that was stalking young children. Certainly there's no question it saved the lives of those young children. My understanding of the possession and acquisition licences and the process became much more nuanced than when I had my urban upbringing.

We all want the same thing. We all want gang violence to diminish. We want people off the streets who shouldn't have guns. I always have concerns that sometimes we just increase the red tape on the people like this gentleman I talked about who had a gun as a tool. When we do that, we create additional red tape and work for him. We don't do anything to solve the issue that we truly all want to solve.

Perhaps I'll start with Mr. Benabdallah. I can just imagine the tragedy and the trauma that your community has gone through and how raw the feelings are. Are you convinced that this bill is going to do what it's intended to do, which is to take guns out of the hands of dangerous offenders and individuals?

[Boufeldja Benabdallah]

If you accept our recommendation for this bill that more weapons of war, assault weapons, be prohibited, classified and eliminated, we will all be winners. That is why we came here.

When he came in to kill those people, what did he start with? He started with a war weapon, which fortunately got jammed up. Otherwise he would have caused a carnage. We never want to see that happening again.

So let's start with that approach. Please prohibit those weapons, and we will all come out ahead. We will have reduced the threat against human lives for years to come.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Thank you, Ms. McLeod.

Thank you, Mr. Benabdallah.

On behalf of the committee, I want to thank each of you for your efforts to appear before the committee and express your views. With that, we will suspend for two minutes and then re-empanel.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Colleagues, we are now back on. Our witnesses for the next hour are Alison Irons and Jérôme Gaudreault. I'll leave it to the two of you to sort out who wishes to speak first. Each of you will have 10 minutes.

I just want to apologize to the committee for the confusion over the motion. We were a little caught off-guard on this one.

Yes.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

Chair, could I just do this briefly? I want to do this so I don't interrupt. I move:

That, given the importance of the rights impacted by C-71, including as noted by the Justice Minister, its potential impact on the right to be secure against unreasonable search and seizure, the Committee hold additional meetings to allow the following witnesses to testify: Women Shooters of PEI Dr. Caillan Langmann, Emergency Medicine Resident, Fellowship Program of the Royal College of Physicians Canada, Division of Emergency Medicine, McMaster University Stacey Hassard, Leader of Official Opposition, Yukon Andy McGrogan, President, Alberta Association of Chiefs of Police Richard Munderich (Ajax Rod and Gun Club of Ontario) Gord Zealand—Yukon Fish and Gaming Association Harvey Andrusak—BC Wildlife Federation Saskatchewan Wildlife Federation—Derrell Crabbe Bob Kierstead—Shooting Expert, International Firearms Instructor Kerry Coleman—Ontario Federation of Anglers and Hunters David Clement, Consumer Choice Centre Manitoba Wildlife Federation Fédération des Chasseurs et Pêcheurs du Québec Nova Scotia Federation of Anglers and Hunters Saskatchewan Association of Rural Municipalities (SARM)

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Mr. Calkins, you know that the subcommittee has already met and the witness list has already been agreed upon by the subcommittee, and therefore, the committee.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

I'm aware of that.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

You're aware of that. Okay.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

The subcommittee does what the committee asks it to. I'm asking the committee to include the following witnesses, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Okay.

Is there debate?

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

Is this something we're voting on right now?