Science and Research Committee on May 4th, 2026

[Vincent Ho, Conservative, Richmond Hill South, ON]

We just want to ask very simple questions about things like timelines. We know that this project has failed to meet timelines over and over again. I'll get into the details later of how we got there and how it has failed. When is the first successful launch going to be? Again, this project has missed—

[Taleeb Noormohamed, Liberal, Vancouver Granville, BC]

Why is he filibustering? It's on a motion—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry for interrupting, but it's one person at a time.

MP Ho, the clerk has brought to my attention some rules in regard to moving a motion on the motion for which the debate was adjourned previously.

I will ask the clerk to please clarify.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Marc-Olivier Girard]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I was informing the chair that to resume debate on a motion on which debate has already been adjourned previously, the chair can use their prerogative to put the matter on the notice of meeting of any future meeting, or a member of this committee can move that the debate on the motion be resumed, meaning that it's the decision of the committee to resume that debate.

Otherwise, a member by himself or herself cannot go ahead and resume the debate on his or her motion. It's a committee decision, basically.

Thank you.

[An hon. member]

For clarification—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry for interrupting. One person, please....

If I can clarify, as per that rule, we will have to vote to see if the debate can be resumed on MP Ho's motion, because the debate on this motion was adjourned in the previous meeting.

I will ask the clerk to please take the vote.

[Vincent Ho, Conservative, Richmond Hill South, ON]

What are the consequences of adjourning?

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

In order to resume debate, you have to move a motion that the debate be resumed. Then it will be up to the members to decide whether the debate can be resumed or not.

Would you like to move the motion to resume debate on your motion?

[Vincent Ho, Conservative, Richmond Hill South, ON]

I move that we resume debate on the motion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

We have a motion by MP Ho to resume debate on the motion for which the debate was adjourned in the previous meeting.

I will ask the clerk to please take the vote.

(Motion negatived: nays 6; yeas 5)

The time is up for MP Ho.

We will go to MP Deschênes-Thériault for five minutes.

Please go ahead before this panel comes to an end.

I'm sorry, witnesses.

[Guillaume Deschênes-Thériault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

First, I'd like to thank the witnesses for staying with us for this important study on defence research needs and dual-use resources. I thank them for the time they are devoting to informing our work.

Mr. De Martin, you already mentioned a few points during your testimony about the role of private companies in the research ecosystem.

What are the key conditions needed to ensure that we can truly collaborate with the academic community—including research centres, colleges and universities—as well as with private companies?

The goal is to achieve concrete, applicable results that can be used to advance not only civilian innovation, but also defence capabilities.

[Edoardo De Martin]

The conditions that would be appropriate would be a clear understanding of what the problem we want to solve is, a clear role for research in that use case, a clear role for business and the environment in that use case to work together to advance both those initiatives and, at the end, validation from the end-user. Those are the standard conditions to move any type of collaboration between private companies and research together.

[Guillaume Deschênes-Thériault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Thank you.

Mr. Brett, the investments we're going to make in research are an important part of our defence strategy and investments. At your university, your lab serves as a testing centre for the Defence Innovation Accelerator for the North Atlantic.

How important is it for your institution to have a testing centre and to be able to count on investments in defence research?

What are the benefits of the research ecosystem within your university?

[Paul Brett]

We've operated in a space where we've partnered with small and medium-sized businesses as they try to harden their technology and span that valley of death from discovery to commercialization. Having access to systems like DIANA to attract new innovation into a testing lab, a validation lab, like the one we use at our institution is pretty important to our fiscal health, to being able to support ourselves as an organization. The defence space is an area in the Canadian landscape that we need to be able to tap into. Our ecosystem is just that; it's a place for SMEs to come to validate their technologies.

[Guillaume Deschênes-Thériault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

You said that you work with small and medium-sized enterprises.

Can you tell us more about the conditions necessary to ensure a successful partnership between a university, or a research centre like yours, and small- or medium-sized enterprises?

[Paul Brett]

One of the conditions for success is clear policy around IP. Universities are infamous for stranding IP. How do we work with small and medium-sized enterprises to ensure that their IP is protected so that they can move forward? Understanding the bureaucracy of federal and provincial ecosystems from a funding perspective is also pretty important to our survival.

[Guillaume Deschênes-Thériault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Thank you.

I have one last question for you, Mr. Brett.

As we know, universities and colleges fall primarily under provincial jurisdiction.

What are the opportunities to further engage the provinces and territories in the implementation of research, within the context of Canada's defence industrial strategy?

[Paul Brett]

A lot of the traditional vehicles to move research investment dollars are in place in the Canadian context through tri-council agencies. DRDC has been talked about several times throughout this committee meeting. Understanding how DRDC mobilizes funding in the defence space is also an area that needs some clarity and demystifying, if I'm to be honest, from an institutional perspective. It is important that we demystify and reduce the bureaucracy in those spaces.

[Guillaume Deschênes-Thériault, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Thank you very much.

Thank you to all the witnesses.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you, MP Deschênes-Thériault.

With that, the round of questioning comes to an end.

I have one committee business item requiring approval. It's in regard to the budget for the study on Canada's dual-use and defence research needs. The budget was circulated to all members.

Is it the will of the committee to adopt the budget?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

It's adopted.

I have one quick announcement. We have a Made-in-Canada Solutions for Global Health Security: A Parliamentary Science Fair on May 6 from 6 p.m. to 8 p.m., in room 228 of the Valour Building. If you are free, please drop by.

With that, I want to thank all the witnesses for appearing before the committee. On behalf of all the members, I would really like to thank you for providing your important testimony.

With that, the meeting comes to an end.

Is it the will of the committee to adjourn the meeting?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

The meeting is adjourned.