Science and Research Committee on June 4th, 2026

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

I'm sorry. The time is up for MP Blanchette-Joncas.

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski—La Matapédia, QC]

I'd like a written answer, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Quickly, if you can, answer in four or five seconds, please.

[Mitch Davies]

What we then have to do is make choices about areas we'll retain and that will be maintained and areas where we have a strong relationship with our strategy, and I think we have done so with integrity. We've shared those choices. Anything we did was to a level where we had excellence, but whether it was relevant to the plan was—

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you.

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski—La Matapédia, QC]

Madam Chair, can you ask him to give us a written answer? I read the strategic plans, but they don't tell us anything about the consequences of these cuts.

[Mitch Davies]

We'd be happy to provide further information. Absolutely.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you.

We will now proceed to MP Au for five minutes. Please go ahead.

[Chak Au, Conservative, Richmond Centre—Marpole, BC]

Thank you.

Because of my background in the higher education field, I am concerned about the declining ranking of Canadian universities internationally. That's why I have some questions on those issues.

It has been explained that it is not because our universities are doing poorly. It's that our competitors are doing better and are faster than us at investing in research and development.

Do you have any data on how our investment in university research compares to that of our competitors, such as South Korea, China, Singapore and Germany?

[Mitch Davies]

I would refer the member's question to ISED. I think they would be best placed to provide very robust information comparing Canadian support for research and development in all forms. That's their job. They're responsible for science policy. It's not something that we have a direct responsibility for.

I appreciate the question all the same, but it would be best addressed to them.

[Chak Au, Conservative, Richmond Centre—Marpole, BC]

Do you agree that as a country we fall behind in terms of research and development in comparison to other countries?

[Mitch Davies]

From the statistics I'm familiar with in the various roles I've had.... For a period of time, I worked in science policy. Obviously, Canada's role in research and development overall and the level of research and development comparatively have been lower in some cases than they are in comparative countries. Public research and development support has been strong. Higher education research and development support has been very strong on a per capita basis in Canada for many decades. That's why we have great universities today.

I think there is also a question about private research and development. That's the research development undertaken by businesses. Unfortunately, the trend in that has been declining over the years. Obviously, that's concerning when it comes to long-term industrial development and growth relative to our competitors. There is a lot in those trends that we have to look at and take seriously to figure out what we do to respond.

There has been some recent movement in research and development in the private sector in the most recent statistics. Again, it's not something I'm following directly, so I'd refer you to Statistics Canada or ISED to get more information on it.

[Chak Au, Conservative, Richmond Centre—Marpole, BC]

According to my research, South Korea invests about 5% of its GDP in research and development, Germany invests 3.1%, China invests 2.6% and Singapore invests 2.1%. Canada invests only 1.7%, so we are actually behind other countries. Because of that, we have insufficient investment in research and development, and the fact is that, increasingly, our universities have had to rely on foreign sponsorship or investment in our research. The concern is that, in many cases, the benefits of the research will go to the foreign countries or the sponsors overseas. We are actually sponsoring our competitors because the benefits of the results would accelerate their research.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Please provide a 15-second answer.

[Mitch Davies]

Building up industrial capability and capacity, private sector research and development, and being able to anchor the ability of our talent and our ideas to be followed up on in Canada is an important goal. There is a lot of work to do to achieve that objective, but it is important.

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

Thank you.

We will now proceed to MP Eyolfson for five minutes.

Please go ahead.

[Tony Baldinelli, Conservative, Niagara Falls—Niagara-on-the-Lake, ON]

Madam Chair, I have a point of order with regard to the schedule.

With the impending vote that we will leave for shortly, by the time we come back, you will have to give us a 10-minute grace period to return, which will probably bring us to after one o'clock. What is the will of the committee? Is it to suspend and come back, or is it the intent to end the meeting and adjourn at 1 p.m.?

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

We have 22 minutes before the vote starts. By the time the vote finishes, I don't think we will be able to start the meeting before one, so we will adjourn the meeting.

Thank you.

We will proceed with MP Eyolfson.

[Doug Eyolfson, Liberal, Winnipeg West, MB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you to all the witnesses.

For Mr. Davies as a representative of the NRC, on a completely unrelated note to anything, I do miss that daily noon chime that you used to broadcast.

On a more serious note, my background is medicine, particularly emergency medicine. I practised that for 25 years.

I do know that when we talk about dual-use technology, there has been a lot of technology invented in both ways: in the civilian research sector that has benefited military in regard to medicine and biosciences, and also much in military techniques and research. Much of what we know about management of trauma is research that was brought up during the practices of the Vietnam War. To this day, we operate in the emergency room with many of those principles.

With this newest thrust on developing dual-use technology, how much of this is in regard to the biomedical sciences with potential for use in fields of medicine?

[Mitch Davies]

Thank you for the question.

I'd say that NRC's history in this regard is quite strong. If you think about the role that the NRC played in World War II in military matters, that extended subsequently to technologies such as stapling for surgery. These are things that cross over from the military battlefield and become something that is generally diffused as a part of our health system.

Today's version of that is equally important, though. What are we doing now? I'll give a couple of examples.

In the defence industrial strategy, we have a new challenge program that's been launched on biomedical countermeasures. What this means is that the forces need us to rapidly respond with countermeasures to threats they may face in the field. That same rapid response translates to pandemic response and meeting needs for Canada. We're happy that we've had a strong signal from the surgeon general of the Canadian Armed Forces to work closely with us to support programs in the biomedical area.

Secondary is the diagnostic medicine in the field. For an emergency doctor, sepsis is a very big concern in the emergency room. NRC has technology that's now been deployed with academic partners where we've been able to identify sepsis on a much faster time scale—which is relevant to being able to do something—using remote diagnostics microfluidics technology. The opportunities for military deployment in remote of this kind of rapidly deployed lab-on-a-chip microfluidic technology also can relate to things that we need in our civilian emergency rooms to support our health care needs. We think the opportunity to use this agenda to advance things that will help in the health care system is actually quite significant in that area.

[Doug Eyolfson, Liberal, Winnipeg West, MB]

Thank you.

I did not know that was being developed. That is valuable. We know now that in sepsis, which often identifies subtly in the emergency department, mortality goes up with every hour that we delay diagnosis and treatment. That does sound very valuable.

When we talk about responses to potential terrorist threats, the chances are small of these chemical, nuclear and biological terrorism threats. Is there ongoing research right now as part of the strategy for mitigating these kinds of threats?

[Mitch Davies]

Thank you for the question.

The NRC has very strong expertise in field-deployable nanosensors, which are aimed very much at detecting this kind of biohazard in the very small amounts. That would be deployed, obviously, by the armed forces if they're potentially concerned about risk, and it is also something that can be deployed for civilian purposes to protect populations.

Yes, we have experts in that. I think that's another area that can continue to be advanced, particularly as we're making significant investments in defence. It will have a benefit more generally as well. Yes, we have that kind of work going on at the council.

[Doug Eyolfson, Liberal, Winnipeg West, MB]

Thank you. That's very useful.

How much more time do I have, Madam Chair?

[The Chair, Liberal, Salma Zahid]

You have 15 seconds.

[Doug Eyolfson, Liberal, Winnipeg West, MB]

With that, I will thank the witnesses for their answers and for coming.