Status of Women Committee on Oct. 6th, 2009

[Bruce Stanton, Conservative, Simcoe North, ON]

Okay. I don't see that in the English version, but anyway, the—

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

I see what you're saying. You're saying that in the motion it doesn't mention Canada. The report of Amnesty International is about Canada.

[Bruce Stanton, Conservative, Simcoe North, ON]

I suppose that underlines the problem. Because we're not in receipt of this report, to get an assessment of the appropriateness of the motion is very difficult for members. I am not saying at all to presuppose in any way that the report itself might be instructive and helpful. It may well be, and I know Madam Demers to be of the most forthright intentions here in putting this in front of the committee. But in all honesty, until we've had a look and can take a close look at this report to see what steps might be taken next, this might just be a bit premature.

I was going to say, though, there is no question that we need to be concerned, of course, about the evolution of this circumstance. It is disturbing to all of us. But I think Madam Demers hit on the right point, which is that what is required here is investigation of the disappearances. This is an effort that requires the greatest of coordination of law enforcement, of the provincial and territorial resources that can come to play to help do this. We need to be careful that we're not continuing just to have more debate about it and, for example, more public inquiries when the resources should be directed at the right outcomes.

That is just a matter of opinion, but I would say at this point on the specific motion that because we don't have the report in front of us—and by the way, it says “respond to the report of Amnesty International and the United Nations”. Is it a combined report?

Are there two reports?

[Nicole Demers, Bloc, Laval, QC]

Yes.

[Bruce Stanton, Conservative, Simcoe North, ON]

It mentions “the report” in the singular, so again it leaves us not really knowing how quite to assess the motion. Perhaps if we had the report it might put us in a position where we could consider this motion further.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Monsieur Van Kesteren.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'd just like to echo what my colleague has said. I applaud Madam Demers for bringing this to committee. I think we're putting the cart before the horse, and I would agree with what Bruce has suggested, that we look at this report.

I was in British Columbia this summer and I travelled Highway 16, and the signs are up. It's a tragedy. It's not just a tragedy within the native community; people are talking about it inside the other towns too. They're all very concerned. People are more than concerned; they're somewhat frightened about what's going on.

I think there needs to be some investigation, and should this committee decide to look at that report, I would be in favour of that. That makes sense.

But I'm somewhat apprehensive about being directed by an outside organization, outside our Canadian federation, that would dictate and tell us we need to go in this direction or that direction. We are fully capable of doing those things, and I believe we have the will here to do the right things. And specifically, this tragic incident...it's a national tragedy.

My recommendation would be that should the committee decide, we should first look at this report and then possibly move from that report.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you very much, Mr. Van Kesteren. Am I hearing you suggest that if, at the end of the day, people have decided to investigate this further, this committee will do that?

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

I think that makes more sense than for us to direct the government to act on a report by Amnesty International or the United Nations. We'd better look at that report first and then we can make a decision as to what we want to do.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you.

Ms. Mathyssen.

[Irene Mathyssen, NDP, London—Fanshawe, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I have to say that I very much like the idea of the government responding, because there has been a sense that we, as a nation, haven't responded adequately.

I'm a bit confused. The government itself has supported NWAC in doing research, so the government doesn't seem to be averse to receiving information and research. And certainly Amnesty International and the United Nations are eminently respectable bodies, and I'm quite sure the work they've done is quite legitimate and quite instructive. And I'm also quite sure that it's in response to a horrific situation that has been part of the tragedy that first nations women have faced over the last 20 years.

I would like to see that report, but I don't think that precludes our asking the government to take action to look at that report and respond to it. This very clearly is a national tragedy, and it's one we've been talking about for a number of years. I know that since I arrived here there has been a great deal of discussion about this. Discussion time is over. There needs to be a concrete action, and I would like to see that concrete action happen yesterday.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you.

Ms. Wong.

[Alice Wong, Conservative, Richmond, BC]

I live in B.C. and I definitely know the challenges and all the tragic moments that have resulted because of the disappearance of these women. However, before I even have access to the report to read exactly what it says, I would probably not feel it is appropriate for us to vote and pursue the government to do something to respond to it. Before our committee responds, we have to look at what it actually says, how true it is, how we can act upon our responsibility, and what the resources are before we recommend to the government that they should take action.

Our committee has the due diligence to look at those reports thoroughly before we submit this. So I would probably ask that these reports at least be sent to us to study before we vote on this.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Ms. Neville.

[Anita Neville, Liberal, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

I'm not speaking to the motion, Madam Chair. I only want clarification of what Mr. Van Kesteren said earlier. I missed it and I would appreciate it if you would clarify it for me. Maybe I heard it, but didn't understand it.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

May I, Madam Chair?

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Yes.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

I'm suggesting that we're putting the cart before the horse. I think we need to look at what this report says. I'm apprehensive about taking direction from an outside agency.

If George Bush in the United States were to have said to us last year that he wanted us to respond to the oil sands or something like that, we would be in an uproar--maybe not the oil sands, but something in our national jurisdiction. We certainly wouldn't....

The spirit of the motion is good. We should take direction. So I'm suggesting that we look at this report—it's not a motion—respond to the report, and then should our committee feel that it's necessary to direct government, that should be our decision.

[Anita Neville, Liberal, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

I guess the clarity I'm asking for is, in looking at the response, you're not suggesting this committee undertake an investigation or anything of that sort.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

No. I'm suggesting that before we do this, the right procedure would be to look at the report. It's not my motion to make. If somebody wanted to make that motion, that's entirely up to them.

[Anita Neville, Liberal, Winnipeg South Centre, MB]

Okay.

To go back on your George Bush analogy—I can't let the moment pass—we did take direction on the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples from George Bush and Mr. Howard, so there is a precedent for that.

I'll think about what I'm going to say here.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Madam Boucher.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

I fully support the spirit of the motion, but I would really like to see the report. Furthermore, I would like us to look at it together after reading it and for us to make a decision. For my part, I haven't seen the report; I don't even have a copy. I would like to get one and read it. Then, I would like to a decision to be made in committee in order to decide where we are going. If we could have the report here by Friday, we could study it and talk about it in two weeks' time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Mr. Van Kesteren.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

I'm sorry, Madam Chair.