It's for my son's sake.
Evidence of meeting #8 for Status of Women in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was benefits.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #8 for Status of Women in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was benefits.
A recording is available from Parliament.
12:40 p.m.
Conservative
Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC
I'm sure it's not easy. It's certainly a very powerful story. Thank you for showing that courage.
There are a few things that you said that particularly tweaked my interest. The first thing is that we are currently in a recession, but we need to be looking at this study as being long term. Yes, we have a recession and we have issues in terms of EI and jobs, but long term we know we have baby boomers retiring, we're going to have many skills shortages. I guess what I'm wanting to focus on is the root cause as we head towards this shortage of people.
You say that you absolutely want the opportunity to contribute your skills, your education. We have many immigrant women who have tremendous education skills. I know that the government has committed significant dollars in terms of supporting that foreign credential review process. I guess I would really be interested in hearing from Ms. Spencer on how she perceives that actually supporting immigrant women--especially as we get towards baby boomer retirement--and even preventing people from needing the EI system.
12:40 p.m.
Executive Director, Immigrant Women Services Ottawa, Ontario Council of Agencies Serving Immigrants
One of the things, and I think I mentioned it earlier, is that there are some immigrant women who come into the country where their skills, their education, etc., are part of that whole processing system. However, when they get here, they can't find employment on their own. Some of them are willing; as Athina said, she had two businesses. There are many women here who just want the support that will allow them to launch out on their own and create not only the opportunity for themselves, but opportunity for others, because you hire individuals. There are some women who come to us and say, “I really want to start something. I don't want to go work for anybody. I have a skill, I have some knowledge, all I need is the financial support that will allow me to move forward and start something on my own.” I think that is what a lot of women are asking for, some kind of support that will help them move forward, that will help them stand on their two feet, because they need that help.
I'd like to talk about the agency I work for. There are two programs: one is called “job search workshops”, which helps women who are job-ready to access the labour market; the other one is called “pre-employment”, and that is for the ones who are not quite job-ready. They are highly skilled, are highly educated, but want to learn a bit more about how to build their own self-esteem, how to move forward. Those programs are always packed. When you look at the faces of these women when they come to us, we're saying we wish we could do something more, we wish the government could really help a bit more. Because many women want to start something. They have something they want to contribute to Canada, but they just need that push that would help them.
12:45 p.m.
Conservative
Candice Bergen Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
Thank you very much.
I want to thank you both for being here.
I want to say to Ms. Ngjelina that I think some of the challenges this committee has, and I'll just be frank with you.... We are studying the EI program, and I think the challenges that you've presented and the story that you shared with us encompasses so much. It encompasses autism and the strategy to help parents across this country with autism. You're addressing other social programs to assist parents who are in the same situation. It's definitely a challenge for this government, and I think for all of us, to find ways that the EI program can best serve self-employed individuals.
I want to thank you for bringing this forward. And I do want to tell you that the good news--and unfortunately it's too late for you, because you're already experiencing this--is that we are looking at providing maternal benefits to self-employed individuals. Part of that process, though, is that you have to pay in. EI is an insurance program. So you have to pay in and then you can receive some of the benefits. But I really want to thank you for sharing your story. I look forward to us solving some of these issues, even on a broader spectrum when it comes to autism and the challenges that you face. So thank you for that.
Ms. Spencer, one of the recommendations that you made, and I know you said this was your own personal recommendation, was that women who work part-time should be allowed to access EI. What I'm wondering, and here's our challenge, is do we create two systems, one for men and one for women? If we say women working part-time can access EI, how do we tell men working part-time that they're the wrong gender so they can't? That's the challenge. And how do we fund this? Because, again, at the end day, you have to pay in to EI so you can collect, and it has to be funded, because we have a responsibility to the taxpayers. Could you address that?
12:45 p.m.
Executive Director, Immigrant Women Services Ottawa, Ontario Council of Agencies Serving Immigrants
Men are also parents. I'm not here to promote the men's side of the issue, but we have men who are single fathers, who are single parents, who also do need some assistance. It's not a matter of telling men that they can't access this system. It's making sure that you look at it from the macro level. You look at what benefits will trickle down, and to whom these benefits will trickle down.
The bottom line is that kids are involved, one way or another. We're not calling for a separate system.
12:45 p.m.
Conservative
12:45 p.m.
Executive Director, Immigrant Women Services Ottawa, Ontario Council of Agencies Serving Immigrants
No, I'm not saying a separate system.
No matter what system is in place, there's also a place for modification. There's also a place to create additions. We should look at the realities out in our community. You've heard from one immigrant woman here today. Look at what people are experiencing. Look at the system itself. Look at where the cracks are in that particular system. Let's see if we can plug up these holes, see if we can create something that will not prevent a woman from accessing the system but allow her to be part of it.
12:45 p.m.
Conservative
12:45 p.m.
Conservative
Candice Bergen Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
Oh, thank you very much.
Just previous to you ladies being here, we had another set of witnesses. One of the things they said was that when you look at the entire program, you see that women collect more than they pay in. I didn't have a chance to ask them about this, but from the information I have, typically it's more women who access parental-type benefits. Overall, then, women are net benefactors of the EI program.
To go back to my first question, when we look at the entire program on a financial level, how do we then say that part-time people who are not paying in, or that people who don't pay in at all, should be receiving benefits? How do we--
12:45 p.m.
Executive Director, Immigrant Women Services Ottawa, Ontario Council of Agencies Serving Immigrants
But some part-time people are paying into the system. And let us not forget, we are 54% of the population. Therefore, we would take a bit more out of it, I believe.
12:50 p.m.
Conservative
Candice Bergen Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
Except that a lot of women aren't actually employed, for voluntary reasons, so they're not paying in.
12:50 p.m.
Executive Director, Immigrant Women Services Ottawa, Ontario Council of Agencies Serving Immigrants
Yes: a lot of people are not employed and are not contributing.
12:50 p.m.
Executive Director, Immigrant Women Services Ottawa, Ontario Council of Agencies Serving Immigrants
At the same time, they do have certain needs. Some cannot contribute because they do not have the opportunity to contribute. They cannot find the employment they need that would allow them to generate the revenue, that would allow them to participate in the system, that would allow them to contribute to the system.
I'm basically saying that we can't just look at one part of the system. We have to look at the whole system. We have to look at education. We have to look at training. We have to look at opportunities out there in terms of employment, etc.
Once we look at the whole system, I think then we can really fix it thoroughly. If we continue to do this piecemeal, there will always be cracks coming on the other end. We have to look at the whole thing, not just part of it.
12:50 p.m.
Conservative
Candice Bergen Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
I guess that's where the training would be of benefit, you would agree.
12:50 p.m.
Executive Director, Immigrant Women Services Ottawa, Ontario Council of Agencies Serving Immigrants
Yes.
12:50 p.m.
Conservative
Candice Bergen Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
Again, if women, new Canadians and immigrant women, can access jobs where they can work full time, then obviously that will affect the outcomes.
12:50 p.m.
Executive Director, Immigrant Women Services Ottawa, Ontario Council of Agencies Serving Immigrants
Of course. You'll have them contributing more into the system.
12:50 p.m.
Conservative
Candice Bergen Conservative Portage—Lisgar, MB
Right.
Hopefully, then, the new money we've put toward training in our economic action plan will benefit immigrant women. Do you see that as a benefit?
12:50 p.m.
Executive Director, Immigrant Women Services Ottawa, Ontario Council of Agencies Serving Immigrants
I do as long as the eligibility criteria are fair toward women.
12:50 p.m.
Executive Director, Immigrant Women Services Ottawa, Ontario Council of Agencies Serving Immigrants
For the training; no artificial barriers should be set up to prevent them from accessing the training.
12:50 p.m.
Conservative
