Status of Women Committee on April 5th, 2022

[Dominique Vien, Conservative, Bellechasse—Les Etchemins—Lévis, QC]

Ms. Bernatchez, you also accommodate these women's children. What do you say to the children, who have witnessed these traumatizing acts and who come to that place? It must not be easy, already, for them to be staying in a shelter for abused women. How do you support these young people?

[Sylvie Bernatchez]

We are fortunate to have workers from youth services who get involved in the women's and children's lives right away. We involve the mother. We respect the mother's choice and the family's limits. She is the one who will get her children to understand, bit by bit, that they are in a shelter. The children often think they are in a hotel. It's big, they run around, they have a playroom and they have friends. The children always react when they come to a shelter, because nobody yells in a shelter. So they misbehave, but nobody reprimands them. It's an adaptation period. We go about things gently with the children, also to ensure that they don't feel responsible for the spousal violence.

[Dominique Vien, Conservative, Bellechasse—Les Etchemins—Lévis, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Thank you very much.

We're now going to pass the floor over to Sonia Sidhu.

[Sonia Sidhu, Liberal, Brampton South, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you to all the witnesses who are with us today, and thank you for the work you're doing in the community.

My first question is for Ms. Jeshani.

Ms. Jeshani, in your testimony you spoke about the family justice centre model of providing services to the survivors of family violence in the same location at the Safe Centre of Peel. Can you tell us more about the unique features of this model and how it's more effective?

[Shelina Jeshani]

Thank you for your question.

There are many unique features of the model that are based on survivors' feedback. Again, when victims come to the Safe Centre, they have a safe place for their children that is a child-friendly environment, where there is a full-time child minder who supports the children in a place where they can play and be themselves while the mommies get the information and the support they need. They don't have to bring their children into a counselling room and have to worry about what their children are going to hear.

When people come into the Safe Centre, we do one intake. They don't repeat their story over and over again. We have one file and, again, we work integratively with our partners so that we are all using the same risk assessment and, therefore, speaking the same language. When one partner says, “This level of risk”, the other partner understands exactly what that means. What also happens at the Safe Centre is that we have glue positions. We have client navigators who are there to welcome and support our clients so that they don't have to navigate the system. The client navigators support our clients in accessing what resources they may need, when they need them and how to get them into their lives.

One of the other most important features of the Safe Centre is the ability to bring case conferences together very quickly and, therefore, to be able to respond to high-risk cases. Our recent integration with Peel Regional Police has added the additional factor of what women told us, which was that when they wanted to talk to police, they did not want to sit in police stations and wait there not knowing who was walking in the door. They want to be in a safe, comfortable place where they have supports around them and be able to talk to police who are trained in the issue and who understand what IPV is and the many barriers they may be facing.

Certainly Inspector Hewison can speak more about the work that we do with the Peel Regional Police.

[Sonia Sidhu, Liberal, Brampton South, ON]

Thank you, Ms. Jeshani.

My next question is for Inspector Hewison. In your opening statement, you mentioned that domestic and intimate partner violence is the number one reason for 911 calls in Peel. We know that the Peel police work closely with the service providers in our community to respond to crises. You also work with the CMHA Peel to respond to distress calls.

Can you tell us how your officers are interacting with the survivors at the Safe Centre of Peel? Do you think it's working with the Safe Centre of Peel? Is there a better outcome coming out of it?

[Lisa Hewison]

Absolutely. We're having a lot of success now and we're hearing from survivors how they've had a better experience with the model and how we've changed it. Our service delivery model is embedded with our community safety and well-being framework, so we're not just looking at instant responses, but we're also looking at risk interventions, social development and prevention. We're employing those upstream approaches and services for those at risk.

Another big change for police officers is that my whole unit is actually embedded within that community partner building. For the Peel Regional Police, that is a first, to have a whole investigative unit not in a police station. It's in a community partner building. That way, we're right there, interacting with our community partners. I have interview rooms that are built within the Safe Centre, so that the woman, the victim, never has to go into a police station, because we recognize that's one of the barriers to reporting. We're trying to look at different ways to break down those barriers and stop working in silos and work more together.

Once we finish conducting our investigation, because we're in the same building, we're able to have that warm hand-off to our community partners so they can get the supports they need.

[Sonia Sidhu, Liberal, Brampton South, ON]

Do some of your partners at the Safe Centre of Peel include cultural services organizations like Roots Community Services and Indus Community Services, which serve the Black and South Asian communities? Can you speak to that, how the culturally sensitive...? We heard in other testimony that there's a stigma out there with racialized women and they're not coming out. How can we break that stigma?

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

You have about 20 seconds to respond.

[Shelina Jeshani]

Thank you very much.

Yes, we have partners, ethno-specific partners, who work with various communities. What's really important is that we are able to provide services in particular languages, but also with cultural nuances. We have the opportunity, by integrating, of really influencing our other system partners, again helping the police understand the cultural nuances as well as the other needs the clients may have.

One important feature is that the police on site are in plain clothes and they are all trained in this area, which also helps in the hand-off that may need to happen. Again, it's women's choice if they want to speak to the police. Not all women have to speak to the police; it is their choice.

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Excellent, thank you so much.

I'm now going to pass it over for the next six minutes to Adréanne Larouche.

You have the floor.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thanks to all the witnesses. We might say that the testimony from this second group with us today is very dense. Their day-to-day work on issues of violence against women or violence inflicted by an intimate partner is truly admirable.

Mr. Jaffe, my first question is for you.

We all know that in order to end the cycle of violence, we have to do more work upstream. Multiple witnesses have told the committee this.

As we know, coercive conduct by an aggressor is often a precursor to physical violence, which is why it is important to recognize this coercive control. However, we know that recognition of this doesn't come just by waving a magic wand. We can agree on that, from all the testimony heard by the committee. But it is one tool among others. We have heard about training for actors in the judicial system, but there is also prevention among the general public and supporting women throughout the reporting process.

For all these reasons, do you think it is still important to incorporate coercive control into the law, to reinforce all the prevention, training and support measures?

[Dr. Peter Jaffe]

The answer is definitely yes. Changing the law is useless if you don't back it up with education. It should be part of what every lawyer gets in law school, what every social worker and psychologist gets as part of their training.

There should be a very active public education program. We don't do enough to educate the public. I said previously that we should have public service announcements about what coercive control looks like and how to identify it. We should have it during the Stanley Cup playoffs. We shouldn't just have a brochure in a doctor's office. It has to be in front of us.

Quebec is the only province I've seen that actually has public service announcements defining violence in all its aspects. I've seen it actually during Montreal Canadiens hockey games. I haven't seen it elsewhere. I just use that as an example. We have to really invest in public education and take it seriously.

I think we fall short. I think Katreena Scott testified earlier in your hearings and she talked about amazing programs we have, such as Neighbours, Friends & Families. It's available in multiple languages, but we're not getting it out far enough from coast to coast to coast.

I think we have to invest heavily in public education. The front line, our neighbours, friends, family, co-workers, if they don't know, it's one less place that victims and potentially perpetrators can go for help and support.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Jaffe.

Indeed, we have developed excellent expertise in public service advertising in Quebec, and it is indeed important in order if we are to succeed in changing behaviour.

To conclude this study, we are looking for solutions to spousal violence. You have talked about campaigns in Quebec, but what could the federal government do to combat spousal violence? We know that its role is actually limited, because these things often fall under the jurisdiction of Quebec and the provinces.

Are you familiar with what happens elsewhere in the world? Have you looked at models at the international level? For example, the criminalization of coercive conduct in Scotland also takes into consideration the consequences of this violence on the children. You have talked about that, in fact. Are there other models that could inspire us?

[Dr. Peter Jaffe]

I'm inspired every day by Canada. We have all of the answers within our reach. We have lots of model programs, some of which you've heard about during the testimony. What we lack is better collaboration between the federal and provincial governments.

I realize there are many things that are provincial or territorial government jurisdictions, but I think the federal government can still play a leadership role in bringing people to the table and sharing resources. There are all kinds of great resources that need to be shared more broadly across the country. There are innovative programs in Quebec that need to be shared with other provinces and territories. There are innovative programs, such as the excellent one we heard about out of Peel region, that are modelled throughout the country. We have to do more to share and collaborate.

I also think you make a very important point about children and exposure to violence. It's also exposure to coercive control. We have to get judges and lawyers to stop thinking that family violence is just physical. We have to understand that it also includes emotional, psychological and financial coercive control. Children are harmed by exposure to coercive control. We have to get the message out.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

So it is important that federal legislation or the Criminal Code be inspired by initiatives in the provinces or Quebec. For example, specialized courts have been set up in Quebec, where we are also going to have a tracking bracelet system. So the measures applied in Quebec and in the provinces have to match up with the measures applied at the federal level.

[Dr. Peter Jaffe]

I agree. There are some unique issues in Quebec and other provinces. When victims are coming forward to Family Court and talking about coercive control, they're accused of turning the children against their partner. They're accused of alienation. That is a serious concern. There are many roadblocks faced by victims in Quebec and also in other jurisdictions.

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

Thank you so much.

We will now pass the floor over to Leah Gazan.

Leah, you have six minutes.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Thank you so much, and thank you to all the witnesses today for their testimony.

My first question is for Deputy Grand Chief Achneepineskum. I just want to start out by thanking you for your contributions to the “Pathways to Safety” document.

Since being in the House of Commons, I've been really trying to push for a more urgent response from the government around this very serious genocide against indigenous women and girls and diverse genders. One of the quotes in a report says, “The impact of the Federal Budget needs to be felt on the ground.”

There are more than 630 first nations communities in Canada and 53 Inuit communities, in addition to Métis settlements across the country, yet in the report by Stats Canada in 2017-18 there are only 85 shelters for victims of abuse that had ties to first nations, Métis or Inuit communities or organizations.

We know that six in 10 indigenous women have experienced physical or sexual abuse at a certain point in their lifetime, which rises in the LGBTQQIA+ communities to 83%. I'll go back to the quote “The impact of the Federal Budget needs to felt on the ground.” The national inquiry was released in 2019 and I'm not feeling the impact on the ground.

The report also shares frustrations regarding the lack of sustainable funding that results in preventative actions and gaps created due to a lack of interjurisdictional co-operation. This goes directly against call for justice 1.6 of the national inquiry, which calls on “all governments to eliminate jurisdictional gaps and neglect that result in [improper or] denial of services”. Your report called on the federal government to take the lead in addressing these interjurisdictional issues and close the gaps.

I think the lack of action is costing lives. In fact, I know it's costing the lives of indigenous women and diverse-gender people in my riding. I'm wondering if you can comment on that.

[Deputy Grand Chief Anna Betty Achneepineskum]

Thank you very much.

I certainly would welcome any comments that my friend and colleague Julie may have.

I live in Thunder Bay, Ontario. I also am quite aware of the challenges that indigenous women and girls face in terms of trying to find a safe place within their communities. Many of them have to leave and go to urban centres and, at times, face challenges there as well.

When we talk about the disparity in the funding that is provided to these organizations that provide service to the first nation communities, there is quite a difference in what they get and there's also a very noticeable disparity in terms of infrastructure. Those are some of the things that we are trying to address. Many documents and evidence support that this particular gap needs to be addressed.

Julie, I'm not sure if you want to add any more.

Meegwetch.

[Julie McGregor, Director, Justice, Assembly of First Nations]

As Ms. Gazan said, it's now been three years since the release of the national inquiry's final report. It's going to be a year since the release of the national action plan.

At the AFN, as the deputy grand chief spoke of, we have been reaching out in the regions and meeting with families and survivors. It was very important for the women's council to do that. We hear from them that they don't see the changes on the ground. They don't see the additional safe spaces in their communities. We know that in certain areas, especially in remote or rural areas, it is very difficult for indigenous women to find safe spaces for themselves and their families.

We see the commitments, but we just don't see the change on the ground. The advocacy of the AFN women's council certainly is that the implementation has to move faster and it has to be done collaboratively with families and survivors.

Meegwetch.

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Thank you so much.

Building on that, we have the calls for justice that came out of the national inquiry. I know that former chief commissioner Marion Buller called it a colossal failure in terms of the rollout. Many people have criticized the plan as having a lot of voices, people who gifted their stories of trauma, without action, timelines and resources. Although the federal government has committed funds, it's not rolling them out.

How has the failure to move swiftly, especially with the increased rates of violence that have occurred during the pandemic, created an even greater, rapidly increasing crisis?

[The Chair, Conservative, Karen Vecchio]

We're going to have to get back to that answer. I'm sorry about that. Your time is up.

We're looking at how many minutes are left in the meeting. Because we're a little delayed, and because we do have four panellists, we are able to go until 5:45 today. I'm going to extend this meeting for the additional 15 minutes so we're able to get in the testimony that we need.

I'm going to pass it over now to Michelle Ferreri. We'll then have Pam for five minutes, and then Andréanne and Leah will each have two and a half minutes.

Michelle, you have five minutes.

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Thank you so much, Chair.

It's always a struggle to fit in such big questions and such big topics, but I'm going to do my best.

Peter, I'm very impressed with what you've said today. There were a lot of shaking heads in here—and I don't know if you could see it—when you talked about public education in particular.

One of the big things I would love to see happen, and I'm curious as to your thoughts, is to really go into the preventative end of things to stop the trauma cycles. When we look at kids who've been through extreme trauma, I'm curious what interventions and treatments you believe help children recover from such trauma.