Status of Women Committee on Nov. 25th, 2024

[Michelle Ferreri, Conservative, Peterborough—Kawartha, ON]

Thank you.

I'm going to pass the remainder of my time to my colleague Anna.

[Anna Roberts, Conservative, King—Vaughan, ON]

Thank you very much, Michelle.

I have a question for Madame Dawson.

I understand that you received $10 million in funding, and I want to know if you could explain to the committee what the benefits of your research were. Was it to rehabilitate criminals? Was that the benefit?

Crime against women has gone up, as we know, substantially across this country, by 75% alone this year, so it's important to have that data to help us prevent crime against women. Could you maybe explain to the committee what the funds were used for? Were they used for prevention or for research, or were they used to protect women?

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

I'm sorry. At this point, for any questions that were posed, please feel free to respond in writing, if you could, because the time is exhausted.

[Prof. Myrna Dawson]

I have one brief sentence.

I would like to say that the $10 million was over the course of my entire career, and you can go to my website to see all our information there. However, I'm happy to provide a written response to that.

Thank you.

[Anna Roberts, Conservative, King—Vaughan, ON]

That would be great. If you could just send it to the committee, we would appreciate it.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Thank you.

MP Damoff, you have the floor for four minutes.

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I want to thank all of our witnesses for being here.

I also want to acknowledge the family here today as well. I had a brief moment to chat with you before the meeting, and I can't imagine that it's been easy sitting through this meeting. Thank you both for being here today.

Ms. Rathjen, I want to start with you. You know that the Conservatives have said that they are going to repeal both Bill C-71 and Bill C-21. Bill C-71 included lifetime background checks for someone to get a firearms licence. It also included a provision to forfeit firearms to the Crown in cases of domestic violence. We've talked about the provisions of Bill C-21.

Please give just a quick answer: Should those bills be repealed?

[Heidi Rathjen]

Absolutely not, but the implementation of the measures that are already in force should be improved, and the measures in Bill C-21 that aren't yet implemented need to be implemented. There's a lot of work to be done to make sure that they're effectively implemented, because the devil is in the details of the regulations and the implementation protocols, and I think the fight for these measures is far from over.

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

You and I have talked about that many times. I know that, on Bill C-21 right now, there's section 35 consultation going on with indigenous peoples before the regulations get introduced.

On the subject of firearms again, Ms. Rathjen, you and I have both been subject to horrific attacks by the gun lobby. I applaud your determination to come out and continue to speak out on issues when you are personally attacked repeatedly, and will probably be even after today's meeting.

Gun control is a women's issue, and we know that women are 500 times more likely to be killed if there are firearms in the home. I couldn't agree more about gun control and gender-based violence being public health issues, but we lack Canadian data on firearms.

Perhaps all the witnesses could weigh in on this. Do you support investment in research to get Canadian data on firearms?

Ms. Dawson, I'll start with you.

[Prof. Myrna Dawson]

Yes, I do support that. Currently, with the increasing lack of transparency around the information released about these killings, we can't even find out their names in many cases. We certainly can't find out what weapon was used and whether it was licensed or not, so we absolutely need better data on this because, otherwise, we're trying to move forward without understanding what the risks are.

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

Thank you. I'll turn it to NAWL.

[Suzanne Zaccour]

I would also add that we need to be very careful how we use the data. For example, when we hear this bill passed and then there's an increase in domestic violence or decrease in domestic violence, most incidents of domestic violence are never reported or never disclosed. Sometimes an increase in numbers, depending on how we collect data, is a good thing. It means that more women are disclosing these abuses. Definitely, research needs to be interpreted very carefully.

[Pam Damoff, Liberal, Oakville North—Burlington, ON]

Go ahead, Ms. Rathjen.

[Heidi Rathjen]

Yes, absolutely.

One of the big problems is that very often police do not report what weapon was used and whether or not it was legally owned. Sometimes we need to wait until a perpetrator.... For example, in the mass shooting in Moncton, we had to wait for the court—he's alive—to find out that it was a legally owned assault weapon that was used to kill police officers. In terms of domestic violence, the lack of information is even more pervasive.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Thank you.

That concludes our first panel today. On behalf of the committee, I would certainly like to provide a heartfelt thank you to all of you for providing your testimony.

At this point, we will suspend quickly to bring in our second panel of witnesses, and I believe it will not take very long, so don't go too far.

Thank you so much.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

We are back. I'd like to welcome the officials who are with us today. From the Correctional Service of Canada, we have Amy Jarrette, deputy commissioner for women, and Kathy Neil, deputy commissioner, indigenous corrections, joining us by video conference.

Ms. Jarrette, you have the floor for five minutes.

[Amy Jarrette, Deputy Commissioner for Women, Correctional Service of Canada]

Thank you, Madame Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

I'll start the clock when you start speaking.

[Amy Jarrette]

Madam Chair and members of this committee, thank you for the opportunity to be here with you this afternoon to discuss this important issue.

My name is Amy Jarrette, and I am the deputy commissioner for women with the Correctional Service of Canada.

I am pleased to be joined, virtually, by Kathy Neil, who is the deputy commissioner for indigenous corrections.

I have been following this committee's study on gender-based violence and femicides against women, girls and gender-diverse people. Violence in any form, including gender-based violence, is unacceptable, and we do not tolerate it in our institutions or communities. We all know the far-ranging, immediate and long-term consequences of gender-based violence for victims and their families. That is why, while we do not control who enters our custody, it is our responsibility to address the factors that led to criminal behaviour, including gender-based violence.

Throughout your meetings, your committee has discussed with witnesses the importance of ensuring that offenders have the programming appropriate to their level of risk and need. To address gender-based violence, the Correctional Service of Canada screens offenders at intake for suspected intimate partner and/or gender-based violence. Those who meet the initial screening criteria are then provided more in-depth assessment. More specifically, the family violence risk assessment scale and the spousal assault risk assessment scale are used with male offenders.

Results can be used in the development of treatment plans and intensity for interventions, as well as to determine suitability or set conditions for conjugal visits, family visits and temporary absences. Screening also includes a sex offending assessment, which is used for determining the overall rating for the level of intervention and is integral in developing an offender's correctional plan.

For men serving a federal sentence in our custody, whether incarcerated or under supervision in the community, risk factors and needs linked to gender-based and sexual violence are addressed through the integrated correctional program model, as well as indigenous and Inuit streams. All streams include specific programs for offenders who are in custody for sexual offences.

Through these programs, a personalized plan is tailored based on individual needs. Programming seeks to identify and, ultimately, address thoughts, attitudes and behaviours that led individuals to violence, sexual violence and aggression towards others, including current or previous intimate partners. Research has shown positive results for those who have completed integrated correctional program model programming, with significantly lower rates of return to custody for those on conditional release who have completed programming.

While some women offenders are perpetrators of intimate partner violence, the largest proportion of women offenders in our custody, including indigenous women, have themselves been victims of abuse and violence. As a result, programs for women offenders address issues related to those with a history of intimate partner violence, which also considers their trauma. With correctional programming for women, participants explore the connection between conflict in their relationship and their use of problematic behaviours. They also learn the characteristics of abusive and healthy relationships with their partners, families and friends, and explore how to break the violence cycle.

During this study, your committee has also heard about gender-based violence directed towards indigenous women. The Correctional Service of Canada recognizes that indigenous peoples continue to be overrepresented in our criminal justice system, and many of them are survivors of intergenerational trauma. As such, our supports for indigenous offenders seek to rehabilitate them and hold them accountable for their offences in a culturally sensitive manner.

Kathy will be able to respond to questions that you may have about her work with indigenous communities and partners to ensure that essential supports and services are in place for indigenous peoples under our care and custody. This includes working to eliminate barriers to optimize the full use of existing section 81 agreements while expanding the number of organizations benefiting from them. Over the past decade, there has been a steady and substantial improvement in the percentage of indigenous offenders not returning to federal custody within five years of the end of their sentence. Through Kathy's important work, we plan to continue this momentum.

Madam Chair and members of the committee, we are available to answer your questions.

[The Chair, Conservative, Shelby Kramp-Neuman]

Thank you very much.

At this point, I'd like to welcome Anna. You have the floor for six minutes.

[Anna Roberts, Conservative, King—Vaughan, ON]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

Thank you very much for your testimony.

I have a quick question for you, Madame Jarrette.

In your nine years of service with Correctional Services, how many intimate partner violence criminals have you seen in the prison system?

[Amy Jarrette]

I can speak to the programs we have in place to address intimate partner violence. Approximately 75% of women offenders are victims of some form of abuse, which may include intimate partner violence. It is something that we are very seized with.

[Anna Roberts, Conservative, King—Vaughan, ON]

How many of the individuals who have gone through your system have been able to rehabilitate so that we can ensure that when they are released, the women they've abused feel safe?

[Amy Jarrette]

Thank you for that question.

One of the best metrics of recidivism is looking at the percentage of offenders who do not return to federal custody five years postsentence expiry date. I'm pleased to say that that number has been steadily increasing over the last 10 years. As of the last fiscal year, that percentage overall for offenders was 89.9%. It's just shy of 90% of offenders not returning to federal custody five years postsentence expiry date.

[Anna Roberts, Conservative, King—Vaughan, ON]

The reason I ask that question is, last week, we had a compelling witness speak about her aunt, who was killed by a repeat offender who had been let out on conditional bail.

As Conservatives, we repealed parts of Bill C-5, and one of them was on sexual assault. We can't give these individuals house arrest. It does not work. It's been proven that house arrest does not protect women.

Would you agree with that?