Evidence of meeting #33 for Status of Women in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was young.
A recording is available from Parliament.
National Director, Public Policy, Canadian Mental Health Association-National
A health-based approach reduces criminalization, yes.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Karen Vecchio
We're now going to pass it back to Michelle Ferreri.
Michelle, you're back to six minutes.
Conservative
Michelle Ferreri Conservative Peterborough—Kawartha, ON
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, again, to our witnesses. Thank you for being here for this.
I'm curious if we can touch on.... I believe it was Ms. Jones. May I call you Shaleen? Today, ironically, Uber is making cannabis available for delivery in Toronto. I'm really curious about your thoughts on what the impact will be. I guess I will boldly ask you if you think cannabis should be as readily available in Canada as it is.
Executive Director, Eating Disorders Nova Scotia, Mental Health Commission of Canada
Is this question for Shaleen Jones?
Conservative
Michelle Ferreri Conservative Peterborough—Kawartha, ON
Who spoke about the cannabis? Was it Mary?
I'm sorry about that, Shaleen.
Go ahead, Mary.
Director, Policy, Mental Health Commission of Canada
Because of the Cannabis Act, there's a regulatory framework for making cannabis available under certain restrictions. The Cannabis Act is currently under review, which just opened up a few weeks back.
It's very difficult to know whether legalization has driven the increased rates of cannabis use among those who use that, as I mentioned earlier, or how much of that is part of the response to the stresses and distress during the pandemic, with the social isolation and that whole constellation of mental health and substance use impacts.
I think the answer to your question is going to be examined over the review of the Cannabis Act. We have a suite of research on the relationship between mental health and cannabis, which the Mental Health Commission has been funding for the past five years, so we look forward to bringing those findings into that conversation. It's not a direct answer, but nevertheless it's the one that I would give.
Conservative
Michelle Ferreri Conservative Peterborough—Kawartha, ON
I think it's an important conversation to open up. There's a distinction, obviously, between recreational and pharmaceutical use, for sure, and I want to be clear on that. Where I'm going with this is.... We do have an increase in stress and maladaptive coping mechanisms, not just for adults but for children as well as they try to navigate the social stress that's been put on them. Now there is an affordability crisis, which we've heard from other witnesses is downloaded to the children.
Would you want to see research on what happens to those young people with developing brains who are turning to cannabis as a maladaptive coping mechanism because they don't have access to the support or healthy coping mechanisms that should be available when they need help or counselling?
Director, Policy, Mental Health Commission of Canada
I absolutely think, 100%, that children and young people who are experiencing mental health concerns should have access to high-quality treatment that's culturally competent and equitably funded, with low financial barriers.
The other parts of the question are packed with too many things to be able to give a resounding yes, but we need access to care for people across the lifespan. Intervention at an early age, such as making sure that kids, in particular, have access to those services and supports early on from a prevention perspective, is also incredibly important.
Conservative
Michelle Ferreri Conservative Peterborough—Kawartha, ON
I'd love to see stats and data put forward on the impacts of the use for those who are turning to cannabis as a maladaptive coping mechanism, for that developing brain.
I'm going to turn to Jennifer from BC Children's Hospital. Do you have any stats on the mental health of the mothers of the young women you are treating?
Psychologist, Provincial Specialized Eating Disorders Program, BC Children’s Hospital
When you say “stats”, do you mean in terms of their well-being generally?
Conservative
Michelle Ferreri Conservative Peterborough—Kawartha, ON
Yes. Do you see a correlation between mothers who suffer from anxiety or depression or who are diagnosed with a mental illness and young women who are developing eating disorders?
Psychologist, Provincial Specialized Eating Disorders Program, BC Children’s Hospital
What I really want to highlight is that we know that parents are actually the best resource for supporting their child. Parents are the ones who know their child best. Even parents who have their own mental health concerns, whether anxiety, depression, or their own eating disorder, can be the best support. In one of our evidence-based approaches.... Family-based treatments for eating disorders can be helpful regardless of what mental health concerns parents bring.
At the same time, we know that having a child with an eating disorder is very stressful. One of the factors that we talk about with families is the cliché that you need to put your own oxygen mask on in the plane before you can help a child. If a parent's mental health concerns are interfering with their own ability to function, of course this is going to have an impact on their ability to support their child with an eating disorder, and other children in the family as well. We know that siblings can also be impacted when there's an eating disorder in the house or when parents are not able to function well because of their mental health concerns.
Conservative
Michelle Ferreri Conservative Peterborough—Kawartha, ON
Thank you so much.
The point I'm getting across is looking at investment in the mother. When we look at young women's mental health, we see that when we have a mentally healthy mom, there's a good chance of having a healthy child—that co-regulation.
I don't know how much time I have left. There's none. Then I won't even ask my question.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Karen Vecchio
Thank you so much.
I'm now going to Marc Serré for six minutes.
Marc, you have the floor.
Liberal
Marc Serré Liberal Nickel Belt, ON
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you very much to the witnesses. Five or six minutes isn't much time to ask questions.
Mr. Rodrigue, you talked about elementary and secondary schools, the importance of which was also emphasized by stakeholders in British Columbia. The federal government is in the process of negotiating a bilateral agreement with the province. There's also the $4.5 billion Canada mental health transfer that has already been mentioned.
What recommendations do you have for the federal government, given that elementary and secondary schools are under provincial jurisdiction? Since it's very important to look after young people, what role can the federal government play in working with the provinces to focus on young people?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Mental Health Commission of Canada
Thank you for your question, Mr. Serré.
It's essential to have a clear picture of the federal government's role. As elected officials, you can put in place a dedicated mental health transfer, which is particularly important.
We know that the provinces have major problems in health care and that too often it's because of the stigma attached to mental health. When tough budget choices are made, mental health is left behind.
So I strongly recommend that dedicated transfers for mental health be put forward to allow provinces to determine the investments they deem most important. I hope that prevention in elementary and secondary schools, as well as at the post‑secondary level, will be among those priorities.
Liberal
Marc Serré Liberal Nickel Belt, ON
That's great, because today's meeting is about youth prevention. That will help us a lot.
Dr. Afifi, you said that wait times for violence prevention need to be reduced. You also mentioned the lack of data, using statistics from the U.S.
What are your recommendations for the federal government to enrich the conversations on this issue and to ensure that the money goes to evidence‑based psychological treatments?
How can we ensure that we are using the right data to target the work that needs to be done in mental health, especially with youth?
October 17th, 2022 / 12:20 p.m.
Professor, As an Individual
Thank you for the question.
We have a great opportunity to collect data in Canada through Statistics Canada, and we don't take advantage of that. We have a lot of health surveys that are in place. Some are focused on children and children's health. We could very easily be putting indicators of violence and adverse experiences that children could have into those surveys. We can do that for adult surveys as well. This isn't a new thing to suggest.
Statistics Canada has some measures in some studies, but they're very limited. Sometimes, when the study comes up to run again, those measures are often the first to be pulled out and it sometimes becomes a big conversation about why we need them in there.
We have the infrastructure in place to easily collect that data. We need to understand the importance of it and recognize that countries all over the world collect very high-quality data in a very safe way, so Canada is behind in this. We need to have more data in Canada, so that we can make evidence-based decisions with Canadian data.
Liberal
Marc Serré Liberal Nickel Belt, ON
That's good. Thank you very much.
Sarah Kennell, thank you so much for the work you do. Pat MacDonald at the Sudbury Canadian Mental Health Association and her team in greater Sudbury also do amazing work.
You mentioned the 50% earmarked as a condition from the federal government to the provinces for community-based agencies. If we look at.... We talked about decriminalization. We're looking at B.C. We have an agreement with the province of B.C. In Sudbury, for example, there's a safe consumption site that was just put up. It was funded by the federal government and the city. The province did not want to fund it.
What happens when some provinces don't want to look at community-based agencies, some of the conditions or safe consumption sites? What recommendations do you have for the federal government to deal with this?
National Director, Public Policy, Canadian Mental Health Association-National
Thank you for your question, Mr. Serré.
The reality is that there is community-based mental health and substance use health service delivery across the country right now. It's organizations like my colleague Abrar's that are creating service and meeting need because of the demand.
The challenge is that these organizations operate on shoestring budgets and don't often have reliable funding from their provincial or territorial governments that allows them to scale up and expand service delivery to meet that rising demand. It's demand, frankly, that was there prepandemic.
My recommendation to the federal government is to collaborate with provinces and territories to identify those best practices and the organizations that have strong track records, and to bring those organizations into provincial and territorial funding mechanisms, which are often there. We have great models in Ontario and British Columbia of funding for community-based care.
Regarding the issues of safe consumption and safe supply, these programs are popping up across the country. We know that there's peer support and there are buses in Winnipeg. There are great examples of work being done already. Police departments are great allies, as are paramedics. Ally with those organizations that are already doing the work. They're at the forefront.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Karen Vecchio
Excellent. Thank you so much, Sarah.
We'll move back now to Andréanne, for six minutes.
Bloc
Andréanne Larouche Bloc Shefford, QC
Thank you, Madam Chair.
I'll try to find some information in the preliminary notes, but I'd like more explanation.
Mr. Rodrigue, you talked about a gender paradox in suicide prevention. Could you elaborate on that? What is this paradox?
Dr. Bartram, you can respond as well, if you wish.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Mental Health Commission of Canada
The reason for this paradox is complex to explain.
Dr. Bartram, do you want to respond?
Director, Policy, Mental Health Commission of Canada
Sure, I can speak to that.
The gender paradox in completed suicides and suicidal ideation is fairly well established. We know that women, young women and girls are more likely to experience symptoms of depression and anxiety, which are also closely connected to suicidal ideation. Gender socialization clearly has something to do with why women and girls are more likely to have these expressions of distress. Men and boys have tended historically, and we've seen through the pandemic as well, to express those types of things with a higher degree of problematic substance use, so we see those statistics come out over and over again.
Surprisingly, women have been more likely to express thoughts of suicide, and men tend to die by suicide. Access to means and knowledge about means are more concentrated among men than women. As Michel mentioned, the importance of better understanding of the experiences of women and girls is something on our agenda for next year. We just completed a study around men and mental health and suicide prevention. We want to extend that to look further into the issues related to women. We see gender roles playing a big part in all of this, as well as some of the issues that Sarah mentioned around how those shape people's agency in our society.
Bloc
Andréanne Larouche Bloc Shefford, QC
Thank you very much.
Dr. Coelho, you talked about Australia in your opening remarks. Are there any models in other countries that the committee could draw on in its work on mental health?