Evidence of meeting #37 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was sms.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Merv Tweed
Sorry, I'm just trying to give everybody a little bit of time.
Mr. Julian.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC
I'm glad Mr. Holbrook will be coming back to be with us, because we have far too much content to go over.
I would like to just quickly review in the few minutes we have left. The parliamentary secretary, Mr. Jean, only addressed one page, and that was the theory of the issue....
Are you going to try to filibuster, Brian?
Conservative
Brian Jean Conservative Fort McMurray—Athabasca, AB
No. I want to obey the rules, and the rules are that all the members have a chance to ask a question before any other member. Mr. Watson actually has a question right now.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Merv Tweed
I have three minutes with Mr. Julian, and that will leave time for Mr. Watson.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
Mr. Holbrook, what are the average years worked in aviation of the inspectors in the survey?
National Chair, Canadian Federal Pilots Association
It's approximately 28 years, and their average time with Transport Canada is approximately 11 years.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC
So the brightest and the best responded to this survey. In theory, of course, they support the SMS. In fact most people who have come forward have said they support it in theory.
What percentage of those inspectors believe that Mr. Cannon's proposed SMS would provoke a higher level of risk in Canada's aviation system?
National Chair, Canadian Federal Pilots Association
It that case it's over two-thirds of our group.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC
I believe it's 67%, from page 10. So they believe it in theory, but they believe that Mr. Cannon's particular plan will actually increase the risk to aviation.
What percentage of those inspectors believe that Mr. Cannon's proposed SMS would prevent them from addressing and correcting certificate-holder safety problems in a timely fashion before they happen?
National Chair, Canadian Federal Pilots Association
That would be 80% of the group.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC
So 80% of these inspectors, the brightest and the best, the most experienced in the country, believe it would prevent them from addressing and correcting the safety problems. That's very important to note, Mr. Chair.
What percentage of the brightest and best of Canada's aviation inspections believe that if the travelling public knew what was being planned by Mr. Cannon, their level of confidence in the safety of Canada's aviation system would decrease?
National Chair, Canadian Federal Pilots Association
That would be 77% of the group.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC
That's over three-quarters then. So they certainly support it in theory, but 77% of them believe that if the travelling public knew, they would be concerned about this.
What percentage are personally worried about air operators in airports regulating themselves through Mr. Cannon's SMS safety plan?
National Chair, Canadian Federal Pilots Association
A total of 85% of the group.
NDP
Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC
Eighty-five percent. So we've moved from 92% who support it in theory, as most of our witnesses do, to 85% who are personally worried about this particular plan. That's very important to note, Mr. Chair.
As my final question, what—
Conservative
Conservative
Jeff Watson Conservative Essex, ON
Actually, I want to come back to Mr. Jean's line of questioning. I sense there were some panellists who wanted to jump in and comment on Mr. Holbrook's position. Mr. Boucher, you looked like you wanted to make some comment on that.
I would open that up to other panellists in terms of Mr. Holbrook's position. Would you like to offer a comment?
Senior Director, Flight Safety, Air Canada Pilots Association
What I'd like to say here is that I understand where Mr. Holbrook's coming from. We're not as a pilot group saying that we want to do away with that regulatory framework and that oversight. In fact, the oversight needs to be there; it always needs to be there.
What role, what function they will take as we move down the SMS implementation route, I don't know. All I can tell you is what has been happening during the last two years as our company has implemented SMS. We've just seen a lot of positive changes to the safety environment I work in right now. That safety culture has changed.
Conservative
President and Chief Executive Officer, Helicopter Association of Canada
Yes.
We do not want to see the regulatory function of Transport Canada disappear, and it's not forecast to disappear. The Governor in Council will continue to make regulations, even with regard to designated organizations. Those standards made by designated organizations must meet the regulations, but by giving it to a designated organization, they will also meet the imperatives and the realities of the industry they serve.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Aerospace Industries Association of Canada
I would agree. We certainly see a continued and important role for Transport Canada as we move forward with SMS. Those roles will continue to evolve over time, but the engagement between industry and Transport Canada officials will and must continue as we move forward in a shared way to continue to advance aviation safety.
I don't share the concerns that Mr. Holbrook has shared today, but certainly we see a continued and very important role of Transport Canada.
Conservative
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Merv Tweed
Thank you, everyone.
We're out of time. I'd like to thank our guests for being here today and providing us with some very important information.
It now being 5:27, the committee is adjourned.
