Evidence of meeting #9 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 39th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was investigation.
Acting Chairman, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
If we had found that as an issue, if in an investigation we were able to link the fact that there was no train whistle to an accident, that's something we would comment on. We have a couple of ongoing investigations at the moment involving both vehicles at crossings and pedestrians.
Liberal
Don Bell Liberal North Vancouver, BC
Do we have a comparison with the States, the FAA? As I understand it, when there is an air disaster, the FAA is the first on the ground. Would you be the first, or is there a parallel agency in Canada? Is the Canadian Transportation Agency, which you referred to, parallel to the FAA?
Acting Chairman, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
No. The parallel to the FAA would be Transport Canada.
Our parallel is the National Transportation Safety Board. There are some differences there, but they have a similar mandate to ours.
Liberal
Don Bell Liberal North Vancouver, BC
If there's an air accident in Canada or in the U.S., are there, in effect, duplicate investigative agencies?
Acting Chairman, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
That's worked out by ICAO, the International Civil Aviation Organization, in annex 13, which determines which investigative body has priority.
If you want more information on how that works, Mr. Stoss is quite familiar with it.
Liberal
Don Bell Liberal North Vancouver, BC
I was just interested in that aspect of it.
That's fine. Thank you.
Conservative
Brian Storseth Conservative Westlock—St. Paul, AB
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I'll be splitting my time with Mr. Norlock.
I have a couple of questions. This is not regarding any particular, ongoing case, but if something came about where you could demonstrate that there was a problem with the system or regulation, would you issue an interim report stating this?
Acting Chairman, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
We don't issue an interim report, but we would make interim recommendations.
That's what we did in the context of the Morningstar investigation. We issued recommendations on winter operations of Cessna 208s. In March we also issued recommendations on the inspections of some Airbus rudders.
Conservative
Brian Storseth Conservative Westlock—St. Paul, AB
Are there any other interim recommendations that you have made recently?
Acting Chairman, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
We made an interim recommendation on the Ryan's Commander having to do with requirements for stability of fishing vessels.
Those are the most recent interim recommendations.
Conservative
Brian Storseth Conservative Westlock—St. Paul, AB
How do the differences in the safety management systems across the different sectors--marine, air, rail--impact your investigations?
Acting Chairman, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
Safety management systems are something that is new in the last number of years. Recently, most of the industries are putting these in place. We look at the implementation of the safety management system. If we think there's a problem with the implementation or the way it's being carried out day to day, that would be something we would comment on. It's part of a whole number of issues that we may look at in an investigation, in any of the modes.
Conservative
Rick Norlock Conservative Northumberland—Quinte West, ON
Thank you.
I'm particularly interested in the North American interrelationship of our transportation system, and in particular, the rail system. We've heard comments of late, particularly in the press, with regard to certain derailments, etc., that somehow the maintenance of our rail system is somewhat different from that in the U.S. Have you looked at how we manage railways vis-à-vis the U.S.--in particular, the amount of service per kilometre or per mile that we would need?
Acting Chairman, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
I'm not sure that we've looked at that on a comparison basis. We certainly have looked at maintenance in a number of ongoing investigations. We would particularly look at it if you had a track problem. You would look at the maintenance records and the physical structures that were there, but in terms of the comparison, I'm not aware of that.
Are you, Nick?
Acting Director General, Investigation Operations, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
No. The important thing in our investigations is that we'd be looking at that aspect. We'd find some facts, then we'd go back to the regulatory requirements. In addition to whether they knew that they were there, we'd measure to see if they were applied. Even if they were applied and we found a problem with them, we may then question the regulations and come up with a recommendation. So we evaluate all the defences within the network, the regulations being one of them.
Conservative
Rick Norlock Conservative Northumberland—Quinte West, ON
Do you deal specifically with the regulation, as opposed to looking abroad to see if there's something better that could be applied?
Conservative
Rick Norlock Conservative Northumberland—Quinte West, ON
Do you stay within the parameters of the given set of regulations?
Acting Chairman, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
No, not entirely. For instance, in rail you have a number of requirements that are transborder that have to do with the FRA. There are committees within the FRA that determine a number of things including the requirements for tank cars. There is an integration there, and we do look at those things.
Liberal
Andy Scott Liberal Fredericton, NB
Thank you very much.
Welcome.
As was the case with Mr. McGuinty, this is the first time I've had the opportunity.
I have three quick questions. First, you mention in your opening comments a wealth of experience, and I'd like to call on that experience to assist us. In your presentation you said we could help you by letting Canadians understand better what it is you do.
Give us a real life example of a case--perhaps one of the cases you described in your comments--in which your mandate and the process have worked the best, and tell us why. Then, describe for us a case in which the process didn't work, and tell us why. We can then get a sense of (a) what you do in the context of being able to do that, and (b) what we might be able to do to help in the area of public policy to remedy situations where it hasn't worked.
Acting Chairman, Transportation Safety Board of Canada
I think there are no situations in which it hasn't worked. What we have are situations of some investigations being more challenging than others. Regardless of the challenges that are out there, we work our way through them and do our work. We come to the bottom line of what happened and why.
You asked me for one case that I thought was exemplary--I don't think you used the word, but that was the idea. I think the golden standard was Swissair 111. The investigation of the Swissair 111 crash was very complex, but the investigators were dogged, and the work they did was absolutely leading edge.
