Evidence of meeting #47 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was year.
A video is available from Parliament.
3:50 p.m.
Conservative
Lisa Raitt Conservative Halton, ON
Oh, I'm giving you answers. Just because you don't like the answers, Mr. McGuinty, doesn't mean they aren't the truth.
3:50 p.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
No, you said you have 117 inspectors. That's fair game. It's an increase by one since last year. I'm anxious to see what the Auditor General says about that. You're saying there are 117 inspectors.
There have been no cuts, according to Monsieur Lévesque. There have been no changes to the numbers. He just said it twice in French.
I want to understand. As for Canadians who are watching, they want to understand. They just saw another train explode in northern Ontario, right? This could have been in Toronto. It could have been in Calgary. It could have been in the train yards in my own riding.
Here's the question: with 117 inspectors, are you telling Canadians, the Transportation Safety Board, the Auditor General, and parliamentarians that with a 1,600% increase in oil by rail, there's no more risk?
3:50 p.m.
Conservative
Lisa Raitt Conservative Halton, ON
I'm very confident in the numbers that Transport Canada officials put forward to make sure that they're doing the workload that we inspect and expect them to do. The increasing volume of material has been met by extra inspections, extra regulation, more orders, and more work with the industry on the matter.
3:50 p.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
Let me ask you a specific question.
Minister, do you have a rail safety advisory group?
3:50 p.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
You mentioned earlier that you wanted us to convene CN. I understand that you meet regularly with CN, CP, and others.
Did you meet with them recently?
3:50 p.m.
Conservative
Lisa Raitt Conservative Halton, ON
As I said to the press, I did have a conversation with CN, post the derailment, to ask what they were doing, and to ensure that they're cooperating with the Transportation Safety Board and Transport Canada officials.
3:50 p.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
That's great. I appreciate that. That's an important effort, but I want to ask you a specific question.
Presumably, your department, to backstop the work of the Advisory Council on Railway Safety, your ACRS group, must be performing detailed analyses of the transportation of oil by rail on a year-by-year basis, correct?
3:55 p.m.
Conservative
Lisa Raitt Conservative Halton, ON
They're absolutely tracking how much there is. There's a forecast as to what it's going to be, and that's why we introduced the safe and accountable rail act.
3:55 p.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
Great.
For 2015-16 we have estimates. We have 117 inspectors and have heard nothing about increasing that number.
You have 117 inspectors. Is oil by rail going up, is it staying constant, or is it going down, projecting forward for the next five years?
3:55 p.m.
Conservative
Lisa Raitt Conservative Halton, ON
We are projecting that it's going to be going up, but as well, Transport Canada officials are aware of this and they have set out what they would like in terms of estimates and compensation in order to run the department, and this is what they've developed.
3:55 p.m.
Liberal
David McGuinty Liberal Ottawa South, ON
Wonderful.
I have one final question for you, Minister. Can you commit to table before this committee—because the Auditor General asked for it and couldn't find it—all the analysis your officials are performing with respect to the volume of oil by rail, all of the estimates, all the analysis you have to backstop your claim that 117 inspectors are sufficient? Can you give us that rationale, the metrics, what was used to come to that trusting conclusion that you rely on your officials for? Can you table that for us?
3:55 p.m.
Conservative
Lisa Raitt Conservative Halton, ON
I will take that under advisement and bring it back to my officials for discussion.
3:55 p.m.
Conservative
3:55 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Larry Miller
Thank you, Mr. McGuinty. Your time has expired.
Mr. Watson, seven minutes.
3:55 p.m.
Conservative
Jeff Watson Conservative Essex, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you to the minister and officials for being here today.
According to the Canadian Association of Petroleum Producers, the number of oil carloads, tank loads of oil, was 173,000 in 2013. In 2014 it was 140,000, which is a decrease year-over-year, so Mr. McGuinty may have to rework some of his numbers.
Minister, with regard to the world-class tanker safety system, we had originally put in place an expert panel to make recommendations. How is the world-class tanker safety system reflected in the estimates for 2015-2016 now that the recommendations are becoming operational?
3:55 p.m.
Conservative
Lisa Raitt Conservative Halton, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Parliamentary Secretary.
I am very pleased with respect to the work that we've been doing on the world-class tanker safety system. We had a pre-eminent panel that did some very good cross-country consultation on the issues associated with it. What they found was this: they said, first and foremost, that we do have a good system. However, they did identify areas in which we can do better. We took those recommendations, and we put them into a system to ensure that we would be able to meet the expectations with respect to the world-class tanker safety system.
One of the things they cited and indicated that was very important for us was to ensure that we worked with others across the country, with aboriginal groups and industry. Partnerships with other governments were very important as well. The key is to prevent these spills from happening in the first place. The Ocean Networks Canada's work, of course, is very important for that, and having the sensors and the ability to have the data and information. We also have to make sure that we are ready to respond very quickly in the event of a spill. One of the key aspects of that is the work that Transport Canada is currently undertaking, in taking a look at area response plans in different corners of the country to ensure that what we have in place there takes into consideration not only what we are able to do on a day-to-day basis to respond to a spill with current industry partners, but, for example in the case of British Columbia, also what we can do to make sure that we work with local aboriginal groups to understand what their information or knowledge is as well.
It's those kinds of things that matter when we are going forward to the system of world-class tanker safety that we want. Of course, it entails putting more resources in there, and we've done so. Transport Canada is seeking access to another $5.3 million to operate the new world-class tanker safety system. We want to make sure that we are ready at Transport Canada to continue doing the work that we've been doing in the past. We have to work closely with the Coast Guard, DFO, and Natural Resources Canada to make sure that we implement these things, because we want to be able to move our goods to market as best we can, and we want to do it in a safe and reasonable manner. That's what you are seeing in terms of the changes with respect to the supplementary (C) estimates in the line analysis. That's the money that we are seeking for world-class tanker safety to go along with our other—
3:55 p.m.
Conservative
Jeff Watson Conservative Essex, ON
That's an increase in operating funding, and it will, I presume, be part of the consultation process that you've talked about with respect to aboriginals. Operating funding will be used in that regard.
4 p.m.
Conservative
Jeff Watson Conservative Essex, ON
I notice increases in the estimates related to aviation safety, marine safety, rail safety, and motor vehicle safety. Is the latter a capital investment in the motor vehicle test centre?